TOPIC: Nothing to Prove - Geek Girls

There is also the fact that many gamer men will look at women with suspicion because of past treatment. I didn't even think of it from this angle but I was talking with an old friend last night. We used to play D&D in high school. His take on it was very interesting.

He said that women in general had treated him like crap his entire life. He isn't good looking now and certainly wasn't back in high school. He talked to me about the women that would tease, deride and humiliate him on a regular basis until he finally withdrew from dating completely. Gaming was pretty much his only escape from the torture of trying to deal with the dating world.

I am not going to go into all of it but he summed it up with this. (not sure I got his exact wording but this should be pretty close) "If I don't trust women today when they try and force their way into my world it is kind of understandable. After the abuse I suffered from them I am not exactly amicable to their company or attention in any way. The idea that I am somehow supposed to be nice to them leaves me feeling cold inside."

Just a point of view that I had not considered before that I thought I would share here. I am sure that there are a lot of gamer guys that are not very happy with the way women in general have treated them in the past. From my conversation I am betting this comes out from time to time in the gaming sphere.

Cdsmith, your story makes me very sad, and not solely because I understand it. I was 0-7 asking girls out in high school. I just gave up. It wasn't until college when a girl who was friends with a co-worker wanted me to ask her out, that it even became possible. I disbelieved it until the mutual friend sat me down and said "she wants you to ask her out!" I double dated and learned a love of ice skating because of it.
I could get into a lot of personal stuff in this thread, but I hope your friend doesn't give up.
Many of us have been there, been through that and know its not all bad. It honestly will get better.

Don't give up hope, my friend.

Well, I doubt it is ever getting better for him. He is slightly older than I am and I just crossed into my 50s. He seems fairly happy with his life and I never even thought about his point of view on this subject until I brought up this thread to him. He does have a point I guess but it is sad to see his reasoning.

Then again, he didn't have to go through a divorce and climb out of financial hell like I did. I guess you can look at the bright side no matter where you are at.

cdsmith wrote: There is also the fact that many gamer men will look at women with suspicion because of past treatment.
(snip)
He said that women in general had treated him like crap his entire life.

Women in general.

Yes, I understand the suspicion with which many male gamers treat women in general.

I'm not saying it's right, but I can totally understand how you can come to this conclusion if your experience with women is that they won't give you the time of day, unless its then to point and laugh at you.

Look at it from a girl gamer's point of view, though: You get bugged and teased about your hobbies. Other girls won't talk to you. Some even throw stones at you. Guys spit on you, and tell you you are too fat/ugly/geeky to ever get a date. You are derided and belittled until you give up on dating completely, and turn to gaming to escape the torture of the real world (Yes, deliberate parallels drawn there).

Then one day, you are told there's a whole BUNCH of people who like D&D, and fantasy novels, and that they are great folks, very inviting and they totally understand what it's like to be picked on and spat on.

So you gather up your courage, go to a Con, meet a whole bunch of other geeks *just like you* ... and then get told that you are a bitch, and a faker, and no one wants you there, and how you don't understand what it's like to be a geek.

Really sad, when ya think about it.

So I'm not saying that every girl who dresses up to go to a Con has suffered the same things that guys have, but for the sake of the ones who really are geeks - who have suffered the same derision that the rest of us have, and who have bled for their geekdom - do we need to make them prove it before we will let them experience the joy of hanging out with like minds?

Does misogyny lie at the heart of "fake geek girl" accusations—or is it self-loathing?

I really wish we could just get to the point where we realize that we are all here for the same reasons... gaming, fantasy, sci-fi, Rpg's, or whatever. Its actually one of the things I like about going to Cons, to see all the different subcultures of "Geekdom". Gender should have nothing to do with your love or acceptance in this wonderful world of "Geek".

I can also say firsthand that Girls are every bit as much geeks as most guys. My current gaming group has just as many Women as it has Men.

Back to the initial posts on this -

Consideration 1: Tell your friend to stop playing the victim

Consideration 2: If you play the victim, stop doing it for your own good

Consideration 3: If there is a real bully, victimize them

Consideration 4: If you allow yourself to be victimized, you will always be the loser in every engagement until you stop it.

Consideration 5: I'm not going to get into the boy and girl thing here because this is not that kind of site, but really now who cares if they are considered a "geek" by others or not if the rest is OK?

What's a geek anyway?

Final consideration: Wimps are always at the mercy of everyone else.

Disbeeleaf wrote: Consideration 3: If there is a real bully, victimize them

Did that to the guys that bullied me back in high school. I just lost it and put one of them in the hospital while the other two stood there in shock. When the two still standing went yelling to the coach he winked at me and said, "Sorry, I didn't see a thing." He knew what was happening but he could never catch them at it.

Never got bullied again.

Similar story from my past, ended up dealing with my bully problem while I was in highschool in clear view of the principles office while she watched. Didn't get in trouble due my history and never got bullied again but not everyone has the physical attributes to do that and honestly no one should have to.

Picc wrote: not everyone has the physical attributes to do that and honestly no one should have to.

Yes×1000

Druegar wrote:

Picc wrote: not everyone has the physical attributes to do that and honestly no one should have to.

Yes×1000

Agreed!

Raven wrote:

cdsmith wrote: There is also the fact that many gamer men will look at women with suspicion because of past treatment.
(snip)
He said that women in general had treated him like crap his entire life.

Women in general.

Yes, I understand the suspicion with which many male gamers treat women in general.

I'm not saying it's right, but I can totally understand how you can come to this conclusion if your experience with women is that they won't give you the time of day, unless its then to point and laugh at you.

Look at it from a girl gamer's point of view, though: You get bugged and teased about your hobbies. Other girls won't talk to you. Some even throw stones at you. Guys spit on you, and tell you you are too fat/ugly/geeky to ever get a date. You are derided and belittled until you give up on dating completely, and turn to gaming to escape the torture of the real world (Yes, deliberate parallels drawn there).

Then one day, you are told there's a whole BUNCH of people who like D&D, and fantasy novels, and that they are great folks, very inviting and they totally understand what it's like to be picked on and spat on.

So you gather up your courage, go to a Con, meet a whole bunch of other geeks *just like you* ... and then get told that you are a bitch, and a faker, and no one wants you there, and how you don't understand what it's like to be a geek.

Really sad, when ya think about it.

So I'm not saying that every girl who dresses up to go to a Con has suffered the same things that guys have, but for the sake of the ones who really are geeks - who have suffered the same derision that the rest of us have, and who have bled for their geekdom - do we need to make them prove it before we will let them experience the joy of hanging out with like minds?

Raven, well said! I just don't understand the mindset that people have to be an "authentic" geek/nerd/etc. Who cares exactly why each person decides to be at a convention/comic store/etc., everyone has a right to be there and enjoy themselves