TOPIC: Kung Fu!

Yeah the thing about the "soft" arts though, they are more rational. I would rather just redirect my opp. attacks with Tai Chi, than try to land a blow to a single spot of the body, although if it came down to it I would use the "hard" art of Kempo, because it's more of a street fighting art, the trys to save your body, while destroying the others. And the tech. are interchangeable, because Kempo was formed from Tai Chi.

*pixie makes mental note to stay very far away so as to never pester, annoy or worse make these guys angry*

Yeah the thing about the "soft" arts though, they are more rational. I would rather just redirect my opp. attacks with Tai Chi, than try to land a blow to a single spot of the body, although if it came down to it I would use the "hard" art of Kempo, because it's more of a street fighting art, the trys to save your body, while destroying the others. And the tech. are interchangeable, because Kempo was formed from Tai Chi.

I agree in general, but the benefit of the harder arts is that they are much easier to learn. You can be *effective* with them in much less time, generally. Aikido, for instance, is a great art, and very effective...once you have spent about a decade in training. Otherwise, when faced with the reality of a full-speed, real fight...it won't be pretty.

But it doesn't take long for a dedicated martial artist to become minimally proficient in throwing kicks and punches, blocks, etc. Couple of years, on average, for someone to get the basics to the point where they would stand a chance in a real fight.

The softer arts, because they rely on precision much more than power, take longer to develop. So each has its benefits.

The exception to this that I have found is Brazilian jiu-jitsu. It doesn't take long training in BJJ for one to become fairly proficient in self-defense. I think this is mostly because, while throwing a punch comes naturally to many people, grappling does not. And once you've learned a little about grappling, you're well beyond the unskilled fighter there.

*pixie makes mental note to stay very far away so as to never pester, annoy or worse make these guys angry*

Nah. Actually, someone who's serious about training in a martial art probably has better control over their temper than the average joe. And, speaking for myself...knowing what I *can* do makes me really want to avoid having to do it. (Not that I'm some super destructo dude, but let's face it, I have spent 12 years now learning to hurt people.) One of the most impressive things I ever heard was from my first TKD instructor, who said "I have spend 15 years training in the martial arts, and I have never had to use it." He wasn't being completely honest, of course. Every time he walked away from a potential fight, or used diplomacy to avoid a fight he knew he could have won, he was using his training.

That said...if I don't make it all the way through TD next year...HI-KEEBA!

But my point in the story above was that the guy, claiming confidently that he could shoot me before I could kick him, DID NOT HAVE A GUN ON HIM.

Yeah, I knew what you meant. I was just messing with you. But most of the techniques you see in the movies never would work. They take too much time to do in a fight Although I've seen a rare few pull it off.

In tournaments there are some kicks but most are punches.

I learned Shudo Kan, which basically taught us how to incapacitate your opponent as fast as possible.

(And since I only studied it for 3-4 years and never got to black belt, I'm sure you're much better than I.)

As for knocking people out with one punch it is certainly possible. Whether I could do it or not, I have no clue, but my Sensai could knock you on your ass just by blocking your attack. It was amazing what he could do with so little effort.

His old Dojo used to be in a bad part of town and a guy did come in with a gun and he took him out.

But the main thing that you do learn is that you learn Karate so that if you have to protect yourself you can, but the main goal is to never have to use it.

I will admit though, it gives me a lot more confidence in scary situations that I probably would have never had before.

Yeah, isn't that the truth. I have never been forced to use any of my training either, but it's nice knowing that it's there. I only took Kempo and Tai Chi for about 6 months(because they moved the school), advanced one belt, but in the Yellow Belt training they teach you how to break peoples arms(multiple times over), break legs, feet, necks.

They also train you in real street type set-ups(this is only to train to be a trainer), where a group of the trainers will yell obsenities, run up and push you, hit you, kick you, ect., and you have to show that you have the ability to walk away from a fight, while nullifing any harmful threats, blocks alone. It's pretty rough, I thought that I could take some words, but when you mix words with having to watch out all around you, it kinda breaks you down after a while.

I grant that a lot of schools teach how to break bones, and 'one punch knockouts'. I'm just saying that, when the adrenaline is pumping, and the fight is a real fight, it's very, very hard to accomplish such things. The average person can take a surprisingly hard hit and get back up, or keep on coming without falling down. I have taken hits that I thought for sure, the instant it hit me, had broken at least a rib. But even in just an aggresive sparring match, I was able to keep on going, and discovered later that I was just bruised. And I'm not special. I've seen that happen a lot.

There are places you can be hit, where, with enough power, you will be knocked out most times, one punch. It's just very difficult to hit them in a real fight. I'm not saying your school was one of these at all, Mcylyck, but I have met students from schools who don't spar, because they train for one-punch-knockouts...schools that don't teach combinations (multiple strike combos) because they teach that, if delivered properly, one punch 'will do the trick'. This is false advertising, and dangerous to the students. I never teach that any technique will 'finish' your opponent, because I don't want my students having that mindset. The opponent will ALWAYS get back up, and you had better be ready for him.

A good friend of mine was with his instructor at a bar in Madison, WI. Some guy started picking a fight with them, likely under the influence of at least one kind of drug. This guy pulled a knife and came at them. The instuctor kicked the guy square in the front of the throat...and the guy paused for a second, shook his head, and kept coming.


Anyway, confidence is a HUGE benefit of the martial arts. If you have confidence, if you know that you can handle yourself, it shows in the way you carry yourself. And people who are looking to attack someone are more likely to pick someone else in the first place. (This is why schools that teach poor martial arts and faulty techniques are so dangerous...confidence in useless abilities can get someone in serious trouble.)


And I agree about movie techniques, too. Most of that can just be thrown out the window. ANYTHING Jean Fraude Van Damme is seen doing in a movie is useless. Forget trying the stuff Seagal used to do in his old movies, unless you've been training in Aikido for fifteen years. 90% of anything performed with a jump in a movie is useless. 90% of any gun disarms shown in movies will get you dead. Ditto for knife disarms, although maybe you'll live and just be cut badly. I'm trying to remember what *good* movie fight scenes and techniques I've seen...

It's been a while, but the fight scene between Mel Gibson and Gary Busey at the end of the original Lethal Weapon I seem to remember as being pretty realistic. OH, believe it or not, the fight scene between John Cusack and Benny The Jet Urquidez in Grosse Point Blank (in the school hallway) was excellent (right up till the very end, which was at least darkly humorous). Bourne Identity fights weren't bad. And the one between Bruce Lee and Chuck Norris...can't remember the film.

I agree. And as in most schools we were taught to press the advantage. So you don't hit the guy once and wait for him to get back up. You follow it up and make sure they can't get back up.

The Bourne Identity fights were cool. I might have said the same for Supremacy if I could tell what was going on at all.