TOPIC: 2024 Ultra Rare Token Images < SUPER FINAL IMAGES !

David Zych wrote:

Kusig wrote: Are we going to see a lot of undead touch attacks in 2024 and 2025 or will this basically just be +2 Cloak of Resistance 99% of the time? I think we go back to the Wings of Wrath and just let it stay that way.

I'm with Kusig; Wings of Wrath was something cool and different in the back slot, but this cloak is just not interesting. If I were a newbie looking for a UR cloak, I'd skip this and shop the secondary market for either a Lucky Cloak or a Butterfly Cloak instead.

I agree that the wings of wrath were much better. They were on track to provide a nice suite of options to attack fliers by using several slots instead of consumables to do so.

I vote for bringing them back

Picc wrote: For the cloak how about something like "+2 saves, ignore retribution damage" that power hasnt been available since the original shirt of shielding and has come up a lot in VTD


For an additional set power how about something like 6 death knight pieces Grant's the death knight sub type (whatever we decide to make that do, maybe retribution could apply to ranged)


Over all I live the design of the cloak since it will let non heavy armor hedgehog players access the DK sets initial retribution bonus.

+1 and if we can't get ignoring ret on cloak it sure would make a good set bonus either for DK or Arcanum!

I personally like the expanded set bonus adding +1 retribution per additional DK item. Retribution should be powerful enough that taking a large set restriction is worth it

Jeff Martin wrote: How about this for the Cloak? I am going to go with this one unless folks hate it. It seems like confusing than the weird "attack a flying monster 1/game as a Melee attack" power. This will probably only be grabbed by newbies, but it has a nice look and flavor to it.

Thanks for your patience.

I agree it is niche but don't hate it. Go for it.

Picc wrote: For the cloak how about something like "+2 saves, ignore retribution damage" that power hasnt been available since the original shirt of shielding and has come up a lot in VTD


For an additional set power how about something like 6 death knight pieces Grant's the death knight sub type (whatever we decide to make that do, maybe retribution could apply to ranged)


Over all I live the design of the cloak since it will let non heavy armor hedgehog players access the DK sets initial retribution bonus.

I don't think ignore retribution damage should be available easily, however I think it would be cool has a high end set ability for wearing like 5 pieces of the dk set

Jeff Martin wrote: How about this for the Cloak? I am going to go with this one unless folks hate it. It seems like confusing than the weird "attack a flying monster 1/game as a Melee attack" power. This will probably only be grabbed by newbies, but it has a nice look and flavor to it.

Thanks for your patience.

Another option is to split the difference, keep the changes to the name and inclusion in the set but put the single leap per game back on it.

Oooh, good points raised in this thread; "immune to Undead Touch" has the same issue as the originally proposed Hireling Cleric: either Undead Touch will be nasty and this'll be a slot-lock, or this'll just be a glorified +2 Cloak of Resistance.

So while I still don't hate it, I don't particularly love it. I'd rather it not be part of the DK set without STR, but I much more strongly would rather not have STR (or any permanent damage boost) in the back slot.

I feel the "+2 saves. May attack a Ranged-only monster with a melee attack (1/room)" (using the same wording as the 2021 Charm of the Faerie ) proposal as a power would be reasonable, keeping in line with UR backs being +2 saves and an ability. It steps all over the toes of Gnomish Fizzy Lifting Pack but that's just an indication the GFLP is weak. Alternatively 1/game would probably also be reasonable; after all, how many rooms in a module have ranged-only enemies?

This cleric is going to regret that last sentence, isn't he?

Also +1 to including it in the Ancients set -- "Wings of the Ancients", perhaps?

In general I'd love to get more feedback from Jeff during design on which abilities/ideas are interesting to expand upon. I think in the absence of feedback, I spin my wheels on coming up with ideas to solve a problem that may not exist. (This is just me not a comment on the group, please design on)

That said I appreciate Jeff's time, and that fact that he involves the community as much as he does in this design process.

Thank you Jeff. Really. Token design is a fun time.

Lequinian wrote: I use the death knight set and I’m a sword and board fighter.

I liked the wings of wraith (+2 saves version) better. I like a new DK set piece better than the wings of wrath (+3 damage version).

The jump effect really is nice for us melee people.

So… I really liked Endgames original reasoning for expanding the DK set (fighter equipment and all) but RP-wise, how is the paladin able to touch this stuff without taking loss-of-faith rolls?

Simply! They pronounce it "DEE-ath ka-NIG-et" and there's nothing evil about that, right? Just ignore the skulls, they're decorative

PirateSean wrote:

Jeff Martin wrote: How about this for the Cloak? I am going to go with this one unless folks hate it. It seems like confusing than the weird "attack a flying monster 1/game as a Melee attack" power. This will probably only be grabbed by newbies, but it has a nice look and flavor to it.

Thanks for your patience.

So, the UR Death Knight Cloak gets +2 to Saves and Undead Touch Attack immunity and the UR Charm of the Ancients gets +1 to Saves and 3 h.p.? How about at least +2? Seems reasonable to me.

Charms are traditionally lower in power than Cloaks because (with expanders) you can get 10 charms but only two backs (and you start with three charms and one back).

Plus, UR ancient charm is also equivalent of 1/3 of a level.

I agree with people asking for an expansion of the DK set, though. I would think something small, like an extra point (or two) of retribution per piece after three and then *maybe* consider a 'capstone' power at 7 pieces in the future (probably on a helm, to make it a visible armor set).

If there is a capstone at 7, I would definitely suggest making it very DK thematic: something like "Harm Touch: do 10 points of Darkrift damage as a Free Action once per game" or "Unholy Aura: Monsters take 3 points Darkrift damage every round character engages in melee combat". And pallies definitely should never be able to get the 7 piece bonus

NightGod wrote:

PirateSean wrote:

Jeff Martin wrote: How about this for the Cloak? I am going to go with this one unless folks hate it. It seems like confusing than the weird "attack a flying monster 1/game as a Melee attack" power. This will probably only be grabbed by newbies, but it has a nice look and flavor to it.

Thanks for your patience.

So, the UR Death Knight Cloak gets +2 to Saves and Undead Touch Attack immunity and the UR Charm of the Ancients gets +1 to Saves and 3 h.p.? How about at least +2? Seems reasonable to me.

Charms are traditionally lower in power than Cloaks because (with expanders) you can get 10 charms but only two backs (and you start with three charms and one back).

Plus, UR ancient charm is also equivalent of 1/3 of a level.

I agree with people asking for an expansion of the DK set, though. I would think something small, like an extra point (or two) of retribution per piece after three and then *maybe* consider a 'capstone' power at 7 pieces in the future (probably on a helm, to make it a visible armor set).

If there is a capstone at 7, I would definitely suggest making it very DK thematic: something like "Harm Touch: do 10 points of Darkrift damage as a Free Action once per game" or "Unholy Aura: Monsters take 3 points Darkrift damage every round character engages in melee combat". And pallies definitely should never be able to get the 7 piece bonus

Paladin has been left off of life stealing items in the past (ex, ring of dark Health, +2 deadly drow blood mace). Give the DK sword life steal, and leave off pally. Then only fighters can be death knights.

Graven wrote: In general I'd love to get more feedback from Jeff during design on which abilities/ideas are interesting to expand upon. I think in the absence of feedback, I spin my wheels on coming up with ideas to solve a problem that may not exist. (This is just me not a comment on the group, please design on)

That said I appreciate Jeff's time, and that fact that he involves the community as much as he does in this design process.

Thank you Jeff. Really. Token design is a fun time.

And thanks to everyone for their patience with the limited feedback I give sometimes. In some cases I just have too much going on to respond well (so I beg your understanding) and sometimes I have future plans in the works that I don't want to tip my hat toward. So, thanks for putting up with this sometimes frustrating process.