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TOPIC: Safehold Rules Targeted Feedback on the Safehold V Recipe

Safehold Rules Targeted Feedback on the Safehold V Recipe 1 year 4 months ago #13

Ian Lee wrote: The rough dollar amounts for the Mythic 2s wouldn't make any sense if a legendary was part of the recipe as the legendary (using the same system) would be the entire cost of the Mythic 2, making Mythic 2s essentially free.


The "costs" are in some kind of "unit" - not dollar amounts.

Consider a Hireling's "cost" is 50, while the recipe includes:
1,000 GP
Golden Fleece
1 each AG, EB, OE
A bakers dozen other trade 1 tokens

All that costs at minimum $80 and probably more like $120, not counting whatever the value of a Hireling Steward token turns out to be.
Last edit: by Matthew Hayward.
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Safehold Rules Targeted Feedback on the Safehold V Recipe 1 year 4 months ago #14

Wow. These rough coats are much much lower than I expected. Sure it's cumulative to get to the higher levels but I think your going to have a ton of the big guys get there with ease. At the very least Safehold II and Safehold I should be much higher. If not, you'll just need to create another program again which will complicate things more. Or another level above Safehold I.
"Many of the truths we cling to depend greatly on our point of view" - Obi Wan Kenobi
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Safehold Rules Targeted Feedback on the Safehold V Recipe 1 year 4 months ago #15

I’m still unsure how we would make more than 5 of each type of safehold lvl tokens. Would I have to make multiple safeholds in order to create them all ?
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Safehold Rules Targeted Feedback on the Safehold V Recipe 1 year 4 months ago #16

Fred K wrote:

Jeff Martin wrote: Thanks to your feedback, we have dropped the recipe value quite a bit. Please see the link to the PDF for exact details.

Also, I think we are far enough along to spend the energy on roughly staking out the cost of the various Safehold tokens. These are our thoughts on what the costs should be, but this is all somewhat nebulous and hard to define. Markets can be tricky things to guess, so I am going to make a best guess and see what happens. We are reserving the right to change recipes every year, so tweaks can be made as we go along.

IMPORTANT NOTE: The final cost of higher up Safehold tokens won't be finalized for a few years in some cases, but this PDF chart is presented to give you a sense of our guess at the value of the recipes.

The big unknown here is the vast amount of Trade tokens that are sitting on buckets in the closets of collectors all over the world. Many folks don't want to make Relics and Legendaries, so they have been stockpiling Trade tokens for years waiting for something new to come out. Add in the extra treasure for all those VTD runs int he next few years, and things get kind of murky.

Hopefully, the promise of cool new stuff will get the hoarders to take the plunge. That could effect values (both ways) so it will be interesting to see how the vast untapped Trade token reserves will effect things.

Please make it clear in your feedback whether you are talking about the Safehold V recipes -- or the other projected costs. Thank you for your help.

truedungeon.com/files/Recipe_Details_v01.pdf


I’d disagree about the stockpiling of trade goods. The fact that TD ran out of maps this year and will likely see even more transmuted this year is where a lot of those trade goods are going. From here forward, we’ll see whether maps substantially slow down to stock up for this or if they keep going at a normal pace.


Oh there's a lot of players out there with a BOAT LOAD of trade goods. I have a lot, and my stash doesn't even come close to what some of the other folks have. You'd be surprised at some of the numbers, I was.
"Many of the truths we cling to depend greatly on our point of view" - Obi Wan Kenobi
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Safehold Rules Targeted Feedback on the Safehold V Recipe 1 year 4 months ago #17

Dergidan wrote: Jeff, thank you for sharing this. This is the kind of rough road map I was hoping to see.


Agreed. Thank you. The numbers seem fair to me, so that helps calm my fears about the costs at the end.
Classes Played: Barbarian (65 times), Monk (56), Ranger (33), Rogue (25), Cleric (21), Fighter (13), Druid (12), Paladin (11), Dwarf Fighter (10), Bard (7), Elf Wizard (2), Wizard (2)
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Safehold Rules Targeted Feedback on the Safehold V Recipe 1 year 4 months ago #18

Rob F wrote: Wow. These rough coats are much much lower than I expected. Sure it's cumulative to get to the higher levels but I think you’re going to have a ton of the big guys get there with ease. At the very least Safehold II and Safehold I should be much higher. If not, you'll just need to create another program again which will complicate things more. Or another level above Safehold I.


I’m sorry I disagree. Costs are already approaching over $5000 for projected max safehold and one mythic, PER PERSON. What problem are we going to solve by making it more expensive? If you want five people to be at this level call them artifacts and move on imo.
Last edit: by Flik.
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Safehold Rules Targeted Feedback on the Safehold V Recipe 1 year 4 months ago #19

Let's take it one Safehold at a time. I think fhe first two are very reasonable. Safehold III gets a little costly, but maybe that's okay, maybe not. I also think Safehold II and Safehold I are not horrible. It really only reaches the stratusphere if you think about getting all of the mythic tokens. I'm sure there are a few people out there with that level of trade goods, but that's nowhere near me. I'll be lucky to get a couple, but maybe that's also okay.
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Safehold Rules Targeted Feedback on the Safehold V Recipe 1 year 4 months ago #20

Matthew Hayward wrote: on the other hand you could look at is as your first Mythic 1 costs 5,000 units - which is around the amount of trade goods in ~$20k of condensed orders.


Right, so starting from 0, if you ONLY wanted a Mythic Avarice, it's 5000 of TGs. Safehold V is 200. So the total cost is 25x the cost of Safehold V, making it:

• 50× Alchemist’s Ink
• 200× Alchemist’s Parchment
• 25× Aragonite
• 300× Darkwood Plank
• 50× Dwarven Steel
• 50× Elven Bismuth
• 50× Enchanter’s Munition
• 50× Golden Fleece
• 50× Minotaur Hide
• 300× Mystic Silk
• 50× Oil of Enchantment
• 200× Philosopher’s Stone

Of course this is a rough estimate but it's better than not knowing anything!
Classes Played: Barbarian (65 times), Monk (56), Ranger (33), Rogue (25), Cleric (21), Fighter (13), Druid (12), Paladin (11), Dwarf Fighter (10), Bard (7), Elf Wizard (2), Wizard (2)
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Safehold Rules Targeted Feedback on the Safehold V Recipe 1 year 4 months ago #21

Tyraël The Just wrote: I’m still unsure how we would make more than 5 of each type of safehold lvl tokens. Would I have to make multiple safeholds in order to create them all ?


Yes you could make multiple Safeholds, but there will also be people who only want to make 1 or 2 Hirelings and therefore could sell their extra transmuters to you.
Classes Played: Barbarian (65 times), Monk (56), Ranger (33), Rogue (25), Cleric (21), Fighter (13), Druid (12), Paladin (11), Dwarf Fighter (10), Bard (7), Elf Wizard (2), Wizard (2)
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Safehold Rules Targeted Feedback on the Safehold V Recipe 1 year 4 months ago #22

At least remove the golden fleece from the hireling recipe, that will be $50 by itself (currently lower due to glut, but that won't last once these AND multi-year monster bit relic are available).

And, preferably, remove one of the golden fleece from the safehold recipe as well.
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Safehold Rules Targeted Feedback on the Safehold V Recipe 1 year 4 months ago #23

Fleece has virtually no outlets.

Sure, 2023 MBs are much less common than previous years. But, you can't drain people's supplies by never giving them anything significant to spend them on.

Would make a lot of sense, though, to just have ways to exchange one type of TG for another, like exchange GF for 5000gp in recipes as this opens up outlets massively without getting bogged down in precise numbers of specific TGs.
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Safehold Rules Targeted Feedback on the Safehold V Recipe 1 year 4 months ago #24

Looking more at the estimated costs, I am confused...are those dollars? Because that would make sense for Safehold V and IV. But is way too low for Safehold II and I. If you split the cost of the safehold between the 5 mythics you make, safehold II mythics will be cheaper than legendaries.

I think the 1000 & 2000 cost is better suited to safehold II. Then safehold I will be more, but probably doesn't need to be double, maybe 1500 & 2500?

As for Safehold III, I suggest shifting more of the cost away from the follower to the safehold...even as much as 900 & 300. It would be the same cost to get a single follower, but makes it more likely that people would make extra followers to have options.
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