TOPIC: Please take one last look? Can you find a error? Token Images!

Aeroneus Martellus wrote:

edwin wrote:

Dougout wrote:

Iross wrote: Should Butterfly Cloak specify "If slain and not raised" to avoid odd token interactions and rules questions?

You mean we don't get a 10hp copy of ourselves when we Die, Get Resurrected, and Walk into the next room?

Recommend a rule clarification that push damage killing a character does not qualify for being slained and that if a TPK occurs it also does not work since the characters don't advance to the next room.

I was actually wondering about something similar. Say I’m slain in room 7 but am wearing this cloak. Do I actually survive?

In one of the early threads I think they said it’s rooms 1-6. Room 7 is still death

edwin wrote:

Aeroneus Martellus wrote:

edwin wrote:

Dougout wrote:

Iross wrote: Should Butterfly Cloak specify "If slain and not raised" to avoid odd token interactions and rules questions?

You mean we don't get a 10hp copy of ourselves when we Die, Get Resurrected, and Walk into the next room?

Recommend a rule clarification that push damage killing a character does not qualify for being slained and that if a TPK occurs it also does not work since the characters don't advance to the next room.

I was actually wondering about something similar. Say I’m slain in room 7 but am wearing this cloak. Do I actually survive?

Same for dying and being consumed for Lost One effect possibly.

There a number of cases where automatically coming back in the next room could be problematic.

Jeff explicitly said earlier in design that the "appears" phrasing is intentional to bypass restrictions around normal resurrection (e.g. the body must be present and in tact).

Dougout wrote:

Dave wrote:

bpsymington wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote: If a party has 10x Harlax's Helpful Lamp do they get +20 to initiative (+2 per lamp), or +2 overall?

It's not a ruling or anything, but based on the wording I have to imagine that 10 lamps would give a party a total of +2 to INIT (NOT +2 per lamp).

I can see where the wording might lead some people to interpret it either way. However, a total of +2 to the party initiative is the only answer that really makes sense.

The Asterix for the Initiative note is only on the 10 lamp line and none of the lesser Synergies, I'm not sure how that can be misinterpreted., but the clarification will be in TokenDB for people who have that question.

You should be right and I hope you're right. An incorrect interpretation would be "If the party has 10 lamps, this token adds +2 to the party initiative. And if that applies to everyone's token, it adds up to +20 initiative." As stated, the token is correctly worded. But if it's possible to misinterpret, someone probably will. Plus, on the 10 lamp line it also says 5 hp, which in this case does apply to each individual and not to the entire party. Anyway, I'm not recommending any changes, just making an observation.

edwin wrote:

Aeroneus Martellus wrote:

edwin wrote:

Dougout wrote:

Iross wrote: Should Butterfly Cloak specify "If slain and not raised" to avoid odd token interactions and rules questions?

You mean we don't get a 10hp copy of ourselves when we Die, Get Resurrected, and Walk into the next room?

Recommend a rule clarification that push damage killing a character does not qualify for being slained and that if a TPK occurs it also does not work since the characters don't advance to the next room.

I was actually wondering about something similar. Say I’m slain in room 7 but am wearing this cloak. Do I actually survive?

Same for dying and being consumed for Lost One effect possibly.

There a number of cases where automatically coming back in the next room could be problematic.

A lot of this has already been answered.

It DOES work after a TPK. Anyone with the butterfly cloak comes back for the next room.
It DOES work even if your body is unavailable. You reappear in the next room, regardless of what killed you.
For push damage, it was not specified that I remember seeing, but would sincerely hope that it works if push damage killed you.
It DOES NOT work after room 7.

It avoids being problematic by being super simple; if you die in room 1-6, you reappear in the next room with 10hp.

edwin wrote:

Dougout wrote:

Iross wrote: Should Butterfly Cloak specify "If slain and not raised" to avoid odd token interactions and rules questions?

You mean we don't get a 10hp copy of ourselves when we Die, Get Resurrected, and Walk into the next room?

Recommend a rule clarification that push damage killing a character does not qualify for being slained and that if a TPK occurs it also does not work since the characters don't advance to the next room.

You seem to have the idea that the party doesn't advance in the event of a TPK.

What makes you think that? Can you cite somewhere in the rulebook that indicates that?

This is not the first token that would interact with such an occurrence, see for example Shirt of Spiritward

Being able to come back from a TPK seems like a perfectly cromulent purpose for this token.

kurtreznor wrote:

edwin wrote:

Aeroneus Martellus wrote:

edwin wrote:

Dougout wrote:

Iross wrote: Should Butterfly Cloak specify "If slain and not raised" to avoid odd token interactions and rules questions?

You mean we don't get a 10hp copy of ourselves when we Die, Get Resurrected, and Walk into the next room?

Recommend a rule clarification that push damage killing a character does not qualify for being slained and that if a TPK occurs it also does not work since the characters don't advance to the next room.

I was actually wondering about something similar. Say I’m slain in room 7 but am wearing this cloak. Do I actually survive?

Same for dying and being consumed for Lost One effect possibly.

There a number of cases where automatically coming back in the next room could be problematic.

A lot of this has already been answered.

It DOES work after a TPK. Anyone with the butterfly cloak comes back for the next room.
It DOES work even if your body is unavailable. You reappear in the next room, regardless of what killed you.
For push damage, it was not specified that I remember seeing, but would sincerely hope that it works if push damage killed you.
It DOES NOT work after room 7.

It avoids being problematic by being super simple; if you die in room 1-6, you reappear in the next room with 10hp.

At an in person event, I am stuck sticking around and unable to proceed to epilogue after a TPK with the party card?

That is a big discomfort and should be disseminated during coaching if anyone player is using the token.

kurtreznor wrote: For push damage, it was not specified that I remember seeing, but would sincerely hope that it works if push damage killed you.

It was mentioned that this would work if push damage kills you. Unless you are in room 7.

edwin wrote: On Death Knight Mail consider adding restriction against Paladins using. Paladins are classically thought of as good and Death Knight is the polar opposite. Might want to consider extending this for similarly tainted items.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paladin_(character_class)

You’re roughly a year late to that decision

tokendb.com/token/death-knight-armor/

Thinking more about it, the Cloak may become a token that upsets a number of players that don't have it or don't equip it. Nothing like having a game end early for oneself and being told you have to sit around for the remainder of the time slot to get treasure. If I ran into this situation I would not give TD a second thought after that experience.

Pointing out again that "HH" is neo-Nazi for "Heil Hitler." Might be better off with "Harlax lamps" instead of "HH lamps" on the token text.

edwin wrote: Thinking more about it, the Cloak may become a token that upsets a number of players that don't have it or don't equip it. Nothing like having a game end early for oneself and being told you have to sit around for the remainder of the time slot to get treasure. If I ran into this situation I would not give TD a second thought after that experience.

How does this have anything to do with the Cloak?

kurtreznor wrote:

edwin wrote:

Aeroneus Martellus wrote:

edwin wrote:

Dougout wrote:

Iross wrote: Should Butterfly Cloak specify "If slain and not raised" to avoid odd token interactions and rules questions?

You mean we don't get a 10hp copy of ourselves when we Die, Get Resurrected, and Walk into the next room?

Recommend a rule clarification that push damage killing a character does not qualify for being slained and that if a TPK occurs it also does not work since the characters don't advance to the next room.

I was actually wondering about something similar. Say I’m slain in room 7 but am wearing this cloak. Do I actually survive?

Same for dying and being consumed for Lost One effect possibly.

There a number of cases where automatically coming back in the next room could be problematic.

A lot of this has already been answered.

It DOES work after a TPK. Anyone with the butterfly cloak comes back for the next room.
It DOES work even if your body is unavailable. You reappear in the next room, regardless of what killed you.
For push damage, it was not specified that I remember seeing, but would sincerely hope that it works if push damage killed you.
It DOES NOT work after room 7.

It avoids being problematic by being super simple; if you die in room 1-6, you reappear in the next room with 10hp.

Totally missed the post about rooms 1-6, thanks for the clarification!