TOPIC: Time to start the 2021 Token dev process

Bob Chasan wrote: I was thinking of like a UR that allows you to expend all charges(turn in Wand) as a Free action once per game.

Good thought but Wands no longer have a set number of charges due to new wand builds.

It'd be something like wand damage 5x/6x etc.

Good potential token. Nothing I'd likely use on my Wizard unless it's slotless but a good token.

Wouldn't want the relic/legendary path to build off it's design tho.

Endgame wrote:

Arcanist Kolixela wrote:

Endgame wrote: Due to a trend for combo / utility tokens, you get a fairly large auto boost to range damage....

+3 blessed tempest Gloves
+2 ring of the drake
+2 banshee prism
+2 arcane belt
+2 Draco litch charm
+5 boots of the 4 winds

That is +16 to ranged damage without fitting a single token specifically to boost ranged damage, and I’m fairly confident that I’m missing one or two. That, uh, really good.

Still not a token I'd ever waste my money on.

And here i thought you were looking for a ranged token that also benefits from a bunch of spell damage items. I guess Thor’s for you then?

As for me, i would be this twice. Once got myself, and once for the Loaner wizard build for the group.

+16 is nowhere near the +35 average spell damage a Wizard has at legendary level.

+16 ranged damage is nowhere near competitive to ANY damage dealer class on a sliding attack

This design does nothing to resolve the issue of the Wizard not having a way to continue to be of value to the party after expending spells that would be resolved by a cantrip with no charges or the familiar token design that's been posted and iterated on.

At this point I have to assume you're just trolling and I'll avoid interacting with you on this subject further.

Arcanist Kolixela wrote:

Endgame wrote:

Arcanist Kolixela wrote:

Endgame wrote: Due to a trend for combo / utility tokens, you get a fairly large auto boost to range damage....

+3 blessed tempest Gloves
+2 ring of the drake
+2 banshee prism
+2 arcane belt
+2 Draco litch charm
+5 boots of the 4 winds

That is +16 to ranged damage without fitting a single token specifically to boost ranged damage, and I’m fairly confident that I’m missing one or two. That, uh, really good.

Still not a token I'd ever waste my money on.

And here i thought you were looking for a ranged token that also benefits from a bunch of spell damage items. I guess Thor’s for you then?

As for me, i would be this twice. Once got myself, and once for the Loaner wizard build for the group.

+16 is nowhere near the +35 average spell damage a Wizard has at legendary level.

+16 ranged damage is nowhere near competitive to ANY damage dealer class on a sliding attack

This design does nothing to resolve the issue of the Wizard not having a way to continue to be of value to the party after expending spells that would be resolved by a cantrip with no charges or the familiar token design that's been posted and iterated on.

At this point I have to assume you're just trolling and I'll avoid interacting with you on this subject further.

Not trolling - it’s +16 damage that doesn’t effect your build - at all -. You get your cake and eat it too for +16. If you want to go higher than that, you have to compromise between spell damage that doesn’t help when you run out of spells, or + ranged damage that never runs out. A cleric must make the same decision between healing and combat tokens, and every class besides monk must compromise between ranged and melee.

Arcanist Kolixela wrote: This design does nothing to resolve the issue of the Wizard not having a way to continue to be of value to the party after expending spells that would be resolved by a cantrip with no charges or the familiar token design that's been posted and iterated on.

How about a token that allows one 0th level spell/room to be cast without marking it off?
An Ioun Stone you can slide-attack with that does 1+spell damage if you hit 15+?
(You could even do them in different damage types over different years)
A mainhand Rod that acts as a ranged attack that does 1+spell damage? Maybe the damage wheel is damage types instead of different damage rolls?

Arcanist Kolixela wrote:

Bob Chasan wrote: I was thinking of like a UR that allows you to expend all charges(turn in Wand) as a Free action once per game.

Good thought but Wands no longer have a set number of charges due to new wand builds.

It'd be something like wand damage 5x/6x etc.

Good potential token. Nothing I'd likely use on my Wizard unless it's slotless but a good token.

Wouldn't want the relic/legendary path to build off it's design tho.

You’re absolutely right, I was thinking of the old days and three charges. Ok 3x damage and turn in. As a FOP, it beats Bat!
But I wasn’t suggesting the Relic/Legendary path include it.

Singsalot wrote:

Arcanist Kolixela wrote: This design does nothing to resolve the issue of the Wizard not having a way to continue to be of value to the party after expending spells that would be resolved by a cantrip with no charges or the familiar token design that's been posted and iterated on.

How about a token that allows one 0th level spell/room to be cast without marking it off?
An Ioun Stone you can slide-attack with that does 1+spell damage if you hit 15+?
(You could even do them in different damage types over different years)
A mainhand Rod that acts as a ranged attack that does 1+spell damage? Maybe the damage wheel is damage types instead of different damage rolls?

Maybe have this type ability as part of the legendary. Range attack at an additonal +5 to hit and does spell bonus damage plus damage wheel on legendary.

Singsalot wrote:

Arcanist Kolixela wrote: This design does nothing to resolve the issue of the Wizard not having a way to continue to be of value to the party after expending spells that would be resolved by a cantrip with no charges or the familiar token design that's been posted and iterated on.

How about a token that allows one 0th level spell/room to be cast without marking it off?
An Ioun Stone you can slide-attack with that does 1+spell damage if you hit 15+?
(You could even do them in different damage types over different years)
A mainhand Rod that acts as a ranged attack that does 1+spell damage? Maybe the damage wheel is damage types instead of different damage rolls?

The Rod or Ioun Stone would be good options.

The Familiar I suggested earlier in this thread would effectively be the same thing as the rod with a static damage type, the most recent version actually being less damage as the familiar gives no damage bonus.

The token is an idea however it doesn't solve the problem of running out of spells, only delays it a bit.

Bob Chasan wrote:

Arcanist Kolixela wrote:

Bob Chasan wrote: I was thinking of like a UR that allows you to expend all charges(turn in Wand) as a Free action once per game.

Good thought but Wands no longer have a set number of charges due to new wand builds.

It'd be something like wand damage 5x/6x etc.

Good potential token. Nothing I'd likely use on my Wizard unless it's slotless but a good token.

Wouldn't want the relic/legendary path to build off it's design tho.

You’re absolutely right, I was thinking of the old days and three charges. Ok 3x damage and turn in. As a FOP, it beats Bat!
But I wasn’t suggesting the Relic/Legendary path include it.

It doesn't beat bat but it's certainly an alternative option.

I'd be happy with it as a rare FoP. I think it's rather weak as an UR given wand damages. 4x would probably be more in line. Average of 8 damage per wand x4 = 32, roughly similar to UR+ spell damage boost and requires an UR FoP equipped and consumable rare token. At 4x would probably want some amount of damage, maybe 5 to caster or 1x to caster, etc.

edwin wrote:

Singsalot wrote:

Arcanist Kolixela wrote: This design does nothing to resolve the issue of the Wizard not having a way to continue to be of value to the party after expending spells that would be resolved by a cantrip with no charges or the familiar token design that's been posted and iterated on.

How about a token that allows one 0th level spell/room to be cast without marking it off?
An Ioun Stone you can slide-attack with that does 1+spell damage if you hit 15+?
(You could even do them in different damage types over different years)
A mainhand Rod that acts as a ranged attack that does 1+spell damage? Maybe the damage wheel is damage types instead of different damage rolls?

Maybe have this type ability as part of the legendary. Range attack at an additonal +5 to hit and does spell bonus damage plus damage wheel on legendary.

Maybe the UR version has a damage wheel of Fire / Darkrift

The Relic is Cold / Acid / Shock

The Legendary is Eldritch / Melee / Ranged / Nature / Magic

?

Arcanist Kolixela wrote:

edwin wrote:

Singsalot wrote:

Arcanist Kolixela wrote: This design does nothing to resolve the issue of the Wizard not having a way to continue to be of value to the party after expending spells that would be resolved by a cantrip with no charges or the familiar token design that's been posted and iterated on.

How about a token that allows one 0th level spell/room to be cast without marking it off?
An Ioun Stone you can slide-attack with that does 1+spell damage if you hit 15+?
(You could even do them in different damage types over different years)
A mainhand Rod that acts as a ranged attack that does 1+spell damage? Maybe the damage wheel is damage types instead of different damage rolls?

Maybe have this type ability as part of the legendary. Range attack at an additonal +5 to hit and does spell bonus damage plus damage wheel on legendary.

Maybe the UR version has a damage wheel of Fire / Darkrift

The Relic is Cold / Acid / Shock

The Legendary is Eldritch / Melee / Ranged / Nature / Magic

?

I think we are onto something here.

Would allow wizard/elf wizard to continue to contribute and be effective when offensive spells run out. Would help in grinds also.

Arcanist Kolixela wrote:

edwin wrote:

Singsalot wrote:

Arcanist Kolixela wrote: This design does nothing to resolve the issue of the Wizard not having a way to continue to be of value to the party after expending spells that would be resolved by a cantrip with no charges or the familiar token design that's been posted and iterated on.

How about a token that allows one 0th level spell/room to be cast without marking it off?
An Ioun Stone you can slide-attack with that does 1+spell damage if you hit 15+?
(You could even do them in different damage types over different years)
A mainhand Rod that acts as a ranged attack that does 1+spell damage? Maybe the damage wheel is damage types instead of different damage rolls?

Maybe have this type ability as part of the legendary. Range attack at an additonal +5 to hit and does spell bonus damage plus damage wheel on legendary.

Maybe the UR version has a damage wheel of Fire / Darkrift

The Relic is Cold / Acid / Shock

The Legendary is Eldritch / Melee / Ranged / Nature / Magic

?

No look at the Reaver
10 points dark rift at UR Patron token. It looks like the one to beat. A FOP isn’t meant to replace a spell. It’s a NIFTY add on.

If you’re thinking some other slot then you’re talking. I could see having to give up something to be able to do 4x 5x 6x damage.

Bob Chasan wrote:

Arcanist Kolixela wrote:

edwin wrote:

Singsalot wrote:

Arcanist Kolixela wrote: This design does nothing to resolve the issue of the Wizard not having a way to continue to be of value to the party after expending spells that would be resolved by a cantrip with no charges or the familiar token design that's been posted and iterated on.

How about a token that allows one 0th level spell/room to be cast without marking it off?
An Ioun Stone you can slide-attack with that does 1+spell damage if you hit 15+?
(You could even do them in different damage types over different years)
A mainhand Rod that acts as a ranged attack that does 1+spell damage? Maybe the damage wheel is damage types instead of different damage rolls?

Maybe have this type ability as part of the legendary. Range attack at an additonal +5 to hit and does spell bonus damage plus damage wheel on legendary.

Maybe the UR version has a damage wheel of Fire / Darkrift

The Relic is Cold / Acid / Shock

The Legendary is Eldritch / Melee / Ranged / Nature / Magic

?

No look at the Reaver
10 points dark rift at UR Patron token. It looks like the one to beat. A FOP isn’t meant to replace a spell. It’s a NIFTY add on.

If you’re thinking some other slot then you’re talking. I could see having to give up something to be able to do 4x 5x 6x damage.

This is all in reference to the main hand ranged weapon in the suggestion, it's nothing to do with the FoP or the recast token


Personally I still like the flavor of Familiars, maybe we can mix these things in