TOPIC: Level 10 idea

Steven wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Endgame wrote:

Steven wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:
There are many reasons, but in this case, and in the case of the converted Cavadar item, it would be that the benefit would be less valuable to RoSP owners than everyone else. I can't imagine why we'd specifically design an Eldritch or level 10 bonus in a manner that makes it less desirable to RoSP owners.

I would think that the decisions aren’t made solely around a couple hundred players

+1

Exactly - which is why the Level 10 bonus should not cater to the handful of people who think they should get access to the RoSP classes without equipping the RoSP.

Instead it should be something which would benefit those people, and RoSP holders, and non-RoSP holders who aren't interested in the RoSP effect.

I would think that if you took a poll people would be interested in playing the subclasses. The current poll that exist is are you willing to pay 5000$ to play these classes and a small amount have said yes but if the poll was are you willing to play TD for 5 years to gain access to these classes I bet the answers change drastically

I have a suggestion: why don’t you start a poll in the forums asking if RoSP subclass 1/year should be the level 10 player reward.

Since your own standard is that the reward should not be designed based on the preferences of just a few hundred people, it would be worthwhile to determine if there are several hundred people who would support this as the level 10 reward.

Mike Steele wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Endgame wrote:

Steven wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:
There are many reasons, but in this case, and in the case of the converted Cavadar item, it would be that the benefit would be less valuable to RoSP owners than everyone else. I can't imagine why we'd specifically design an Eldritch or level 10 bonus in a manner that makes it less desirable to RoSP owners.

I would think that the decisions aren’t made solely around a couple hundred players

+1

Exactly - which is why the Level 10 bonus should not cater to the handful of people who think they should get access to the RoSP classes without equipping the RoSP.

Instead it should be something which would benefit those people, and RoSP holders, and non-RoSP holders who aren't interested in the RoSP effect.

I don't think they're called Ro7P classes, nor do I think it's ever been said the only way to access them would be the Ro7P. Is that correct?

If that’s the line of reasoning, I’ve got a better idea:

It’s never been said that the only way to access Artifact effects was to equip the artifact (or be a party member under the influence of an Artifact). The level 10 bonus should be you get to have the artifact effect of the artifact of your choice for one run once per year.

As for what these classes are called, I don’t care much - whether they are called RoSP classes or not doesn’t change the weight of the argument that they are the unique part of the effect of the RoSP token, and that the way to get access to them should be to get that token.

But if the names are important to you, I refer you to this page, where they are described as the:

“Rod of Seven Parts (sub-class) Character Cards”

truedungeon.com/resources/item/92-character-class-cards

"These are the rare Rod of Seven Parts character cards. They can only be used once per year by a lucky token collector who possesses a complete Rod of Seven Parts Eldritch token."

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Mike Steele wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Endgame wrote:

Steven wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:
There are many reasons, but in this case, and in the case of the converted Cavadar item, it would be that the benefit would be less valuable to RoSP owners than everyone else. I can't imagine why we'd specifically design an Eldritch or level 10 bonus in a manner that makes it less desirable to RoSP owners.

I would think that the decisions aren’t made solely around a couple hundred players

+1

Exactly - which is why the Level 10 bonus should not cater to the handful of people who think they should get access to the RoSP classes without equipping the RoSP.

Instead it should be something which would benefit those people, and RoSP holders, and non-RoSP holders who aren't interested in the RoSP effect.

I don't think they're called Ro7P classes, nor do I think it's ever been said the only way to access them would be the Ro7P. Is that correct?

If that’s the line of reasoning, I’ve got a better idea:

It’s never been said that the only way to access Artifact effects was to equip the artifact (or be a party member under the influence of an Artifact). The level 10 bonus should be you get to have the artifact effect of the artifact of your choice for one run once per year.

As for what these classes are called, I don’t care much - whether they are called RoSP classes or not doesn’t change the weight of the argument that they are the unique part of the effect of the RoSP token, and that the way to get access to them should be to get that token.

But if the names are important to you, I refer you to this page, where they are described as the:

“Rod of Seven Parts (sub-class) Character Cards”

truedungeon.com/resources/item/92-character-class-cards

TPTB can do as they want, but I would think it doesn’t make sense to spend development resources maintaining closed access classes that don’t generate revenue

Endgame wrote: TPTB can do as they want, but I would think it doesn’t make sense to spend development resources maintaining closed access classes that don’t generate revenue

1. Yes, they can
2. TPTB have a lot more info than we do. They are the sole arbiter of what makes sense. The subclasses NEVER generated revenue. Ever. They didn’t even generate token sales because they weren’t announced until Seg 7 was.

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Mike Steele wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Endgame wrote:

Steven wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:
There are many reasons, but in this case, and in the case of the converted Cavadar item, it would be that the benefit would be less valuable to RoSP owners than everyone else. I can't imagine why we'd specifically design an Eldritch or level 10 bonus in a manner that makes it less desirable to RoSP owners.

I would think that the decisions aren’t made solely around a couple hundred players

+1

Exactly - which is why the Level 10 bonus should not cater to the handful of people who think they should get access to the RoSP classes without equipping the RoSP.

Instead it should be something which would benefit those people, and RoSP holders, and non-RoSP holders who aren't interested in the RoSP effect.

I don't think they're called Ro7P classes, nor do I think it's ever been said the only way to access them would be the Ro7P. Is that correct?

If that’s the line of reasoning, I’ve got a better idea:

It’s never been said that the only way to access Artifact effects was to equip the artifact (or be a party member under the influence of an Artifact). The level 10 bonus should be you get to have the artifact effect of the artifact of your choice for one run once per year.

As for what these classes are called, I don’t care much - whether they are called RoSP classes or not doesn’t change the weight of the argument that they are the unique part of the effect of the RoSP token, and that the way to get access to them should be to get that token.

But if the names are important to you, I refer you to this page, where they are described as the:

“Rod of Seven Parts (sub-class) Character Cards”

truedungeon.com/resources/item/92-character-class-cards

"These are the rare Rod of Seven Parts character cards. They can only be used once per year by a lucky token collector who possesses a complete Rod of Seven Parts Eldritch token."

I think your comparison is QUITE a reach. However, the link you provided does add weight (for me) to the argument that the sub-classes should be reserved for Ro7P. It does state pretty clearly that "They can only be used once per year by a lucky token collector who possesses a complete Rod of Seven Parts Eldritch token."

I still think, of course, that TPTB can revise that to give additional ways to use the cards if they want to, but to me the 10th Level bonus should be something other than the sub-classes.

Relatively new player here - I couldn't care less about the RoSP or the sub-classes. It's just too unreachable as I'm late to the party and playing for several years just to play the once-a-year sub classes is meh.

The RFID chip idea was great. In addition to the ones so far presented, I'd also suggest that lvl 10 RFID be used in dungeon to record a decision that has an impact on future modules. (e.g. answer "fight" / "negotiate" / "other" for room #7 that directly impacts next year's scenarios / room design / tokens.)

Lequinian wrote: Relatively new player here - I couldn't care less about the RoSP or the sub-classes. It's just too unreachable as I'm late to the party and playing for several years just to play the once-a-year sub classes is meh.

The RFID chip idea was great. In addition to the ones so far presented, I'd also suggest that lvl 10 RFID be used in dungeon to record a decision that has an impact on future modules. (e.g. answer "fight" / "negotiate" / "other" for room #7 that directly impacts next year's scenarios / room design / tokens.)

Even though theoretically I thought it would be good to open up the sub-classes to more people (although I've never found them very appealing, except for when the Bard gave a treasure stamp), I think the RFID chip is a better answer. Especially since TD is moving that direction already with the new multi-year Shirt.

Mike Steele wrote:

Lequinian wrote: Relatively new player here - I couldn't care less about the RoSP or the sub-classes. It's just too unreachable as I'm late to the party and playing for several years just to play the once-a-year sub classes is meh.

The RFID chip idea was great. In addition to the ones so far presented, I'd also suggest that lvl 10 RFID be used in dungeon to record a decision that has an impact on future modules. (e.g. answer "fight" / "negotiate" / "other" for room #7 that directly impacts next year's scenarios / room design / tokens.)

Even though theoretically I thought it would be good to open up the sub-classes to more people (although I've never found them very appealing, except for when the Bard gave a treasure stamp), I think the RFID chip is a better answer. Especially since TD is moving that direction already with the new multi-year Shirt.

I would agree that the rfid chip would be a better idea but it seems to much IMO.
All the buffs are relatively small though and I think the access to one subclass a year seems at the right level of not a game changer but fun at the same time.

Miathan wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Endgame wrote:

Steven wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:
There are many reasons, but in this case, and in the case of the converted Cavadar item, it would be that the benefit would be less valuable to RoSP owners than everyone else. I can't imagine why we'd specifically design an Eldritch or level 10 bonus in a manner that makes it less desirable to RoSP owners.

I would think that the decisions aren’t made solely around a couple hundred players

+1

Exactly - which is why the Level 10 bonus should not cater to the handful of people who think they should get access to the RoSP classes without equipping the RoSP.

Instead it should be something which would benefit those people, and RoSP holders, and non-RoSP holders who aren't interested in the RoSP effect.

I would think that if you took a poll people would be interested in playing the subclasses. The current poll that exist is are you willing to pay 5000$ to play these classes and a small amount have said yes but if the poll was are you willing to play TD for 5 years to gain access to these classes I bet the answers change drastically

Well - we're putting the $5000 RoSP claim to the test - elsewhere on the forums I'm offering one for sale for $4,900, with no takers.

Other people have pointed out there are multiple RoSPs available for 4,500 - before 5% GHC discount and ~1% store credit bonus here:

www.trenttokens.com/search?q=seven

So it seems certain that, in fact, the actual going rate for a RoSP is substantially below $4,500 - how much below we don't know.

The last sale I'm aware of was in the sub $2,500 range, but it was over a year ago.

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Miathan wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Endgame wrote:

Steven wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:
There are many reasons, but in this case, and in the case of the converted Cavadar item, it would be that the benefit would be less valuable to RoSP owners than everyone else. I can't imagine why we'd specifically design an Eldritch or level 10 bonus in a manner that makes it less desirable to RoSP owners.

I would think that the decisions aren’t made solely around a couple hundred players

+1

Exactly - which is why the Level 10 bonus should not cater to the handful of people who think they should get access to the RoSP classes without equipping the RoSP.

Instead it should be something which would benefit those people, and RoSP holders, and non-RoSP holders who aren't interested in the RoSP effect.

I would think that if you took a poll people would be interested in playing the subclasses. The current poll that exist is are you willing to pay 5000$ to play these classes and a small amount have said yes but if the poll was are you willing to play TD for 5 years to gain access to these classes I bet the answers change drastically

Well - we're putting the $5000 RoSP claim to the test - elsewhere on the forums I'm offering one for sale for $4,900, with no takers.

Other people have pointed out there are multiple RoSPs available for 4,500 - before 5% GHC discount and ~1% store credit bonus here:

www.trenttokens.com/search?q=seven

So it seems certain that, in fact, the actual going rate for a RoSP is substantially below $4,500 - how much below we don't know.

The last sale I'm aware of was in the sub $2,500 range, but it was over a year ago.

No buyers at $4,400.

With the starting price on Trent Tokens of $4,500 and the 5% discount and 10% store credit, you'll probably have to go below $3,847 before it hits "lowest price on the market".

Prices are seasonal. Typically the highest prices for any token have been a month before GenCon and a few weeks after. It’s kind of soon to know how the year-round schedule will affect things. No convention generates participation (and thus demand) anywhere near what GenCon does, so I doubt prices will totally flatten out across the year. Especially for $1000+ tokens since the population of potential buyers gets smaller and smaller as prices go up. You know, that whole supply-demand curve thing from ECON 101.

I suspect this experiment would yield very different results in June or July.

But, surprisingly we’re way off-topic.

Did Jeff ask for ideas on a level 10 perq, or are we just throwing stuff around?

As much as I really don’t want it to be a permanent subclass benefit, I wouldn’t be opposed to a one-time voucher, if it were transferable (which the current vouchers are not). I’d sell mine for much less than a ROSP, might even give it away. Unless it was a token. Don’t make it a token.

Did Jeff ask for ideas on a level 10 perq, or are we just throwing stuff around?

Changes to Level Rewards:

Druegar wrote:

The 10th-level reward is still under wraps, but I think you're really gonna dig it!

Sounds more like the latter.