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TOPIC: Old School D&D Nostalgia Time

So, can we fix Thor’s now? 1 year 2 days ago #109

Fiddy wrote: Also, even stats we're purposely removed from character cards last go round I believe, so you probably don't need to list them out in the point buy system.


Yes, and it makes coaching much easier to have all odd numbers. Whatever else happens, I hope that stays true.

But something feels out of whack when the total stats range between 70 (Dwarf Fighters) to 86 (Monk & Druid)
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Last edit: by Brad Mortensen.

So, can we fix Thor’s now? 1 year 2 days ago #110

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Matthew Hayward wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Wade Schwendemann wrote:

valetutto wrote:

Azzy wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Wade Schwendemann wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:
The Great Rebalancing is coming, so I guess we’ll see what happens there.


Are you referring to class specific legendary items, a proposed new set of character cards, or something else?


Character cards. The sum of Druid’s stats is 10 higher than the sum of Cleric’s. (They’re +4 DEX, +4 CON and +2 WIS over Clerics, so I hope that gap gets addressed.)

It’s apparently going to be at least two years before Cleric’s get their legendary.


It's like someone rolled stats for all the classes in lieu of balancing them against one another. XD


Yeah I suspect something like that occurred. some classes got the shaft while others made out like a bandit.
I hope for a point by so they are all even.


Or just take the same 6 numbers and assign as necessary.

Our stats are generally much higher than a typical point buy would allow for.


I think even values is good, but using the same 6 stats assigned to relevant stats I wouldn't want - that would mean Barbarians and Fighters end up with the same strength, and Bards and Rangers end up with the same DEX.


Assuming stats are limited to th odd numbers between 9 and 19, there are only six values to chose from for 12 classes. There will be lots and lots of duplicate values.


That’s true today to.

I’m just saying I don’t favor a proposal like: 17, 15, 13, 11, 11, 11 - assign those 6 numbers to the 6 stats of each character.

I would prefer something like:

Each class has 32 build points, which are used to buy stats at the costs below.

Stats cost:
8 - 0 points
9 - 1
10 - 2
11 - 3
12 - 4
13 - 5
14 - 7
15 - 9
16 - 12
17 - 15

This allows classes to have different stats - especially in their highest stat value, while still being in some kind of balance.


I hate point buy systems like this so much it literally hurts. Elite Grid is the only balanced way, or elite grid + randomized bonuses.
Applications programming is a race between software engineers, who strive to produce idiot-proof programs, and the Universe, which strives to produce bigger idiots.  <br /><br />So far, the Universe is winning.

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So, can we fix Thor’s now? 1 year 2 days ago #111

Xavon wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Wade Schwendemann wrote:

valetutto wrote:

Azzy wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Wade Schwendemann wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:
The Great Rebalancing is coming, so I guess we’ll see what happens there.


Are you referring to class specific legendary items, a proposed new set of character cards, or something else?


Character cards. The sum of Druid’s stats is 10 higher than the sum of Cleric’s. (They’re +4 DEX, +4 CON and +2 WIS over Clerics, so I hope that gap gets addressed.)

It’s apparently going to be at least two years before Cleric’s get their legendary.


It's like someone rolled stats for all the classes in lieu of balancing them against one another. XD


Yeah I suspect something like that occurred. some classes got the shaft while others made out like a bandit.
I hope for a point by so they are all even.


Or just take the same 6 numbers and assign as necessary.

Our stats are generally much higher than a typical point buy would allow for.


I think even values is good, but using the same 6 stats assigned to relevant stats I wouldn't want - that would mean Barbarians and Fighters end up with the same strength, and Bards and Rangers end up with the same DEX.


Assuming stats are limited to th odd numbers between 9 and 19, there are only six values to chose from for 12 classes. There will be lots and lots of duplicate values.


That’s true today to.

I’m just saying I don’t favor a proposal like: 17, 15, 13, 11, 11, 11 - assign those 6 numbers to the 6 stats of each character.

I would prefer something like:

Each class has 32 build points, which are used to buy stats at the costs below.

Stats cost:
8 - 0 points
9 - 1
10 - 2
11 - 3
12 - 4
13 - 5
14 - 7
15 - 9
16 - 12
17 - 15

This allows classes to have different stats - especially in their highest stat value, while still being in some kind of balance.


I hate point buy systems like this so much it literally hurts. Elite Grid is the only balanced way, or elite grid + randomized bonuses.


People want to add a point buy to the coaching room?

You hate your coaches, don't you...



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So, can we fix Thor’s now? 1 year 2 days ago #112

Harlax wrote:

Xavon wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Wade Schwendemann wrote:

valetutto wrote:

Azzy wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Wade Schwendemann wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:
The Great Rebalancing is coming, so I guess we’ll see what happens there.


Are you referring to class specific legendary items, a proposed new set of character cards, or something else?


Character cards. The sum of Druid’s stats is 10 higher than the sum of Cleric’s. (They’re +4 DEX, +4 CON and +2 WIS over Clerics, so I hope that gap gets addressed.)

It’s apparently going to be at least two years before Cleric’s get their legendary.


It's like someone rolled stats for all the classes in lieu of balancing them against one another. XD


Yeah I suspect something like that occurred. some classes got the shaft while others made out like a bandit.
I hope for a point by so they are all even.


Or just take the same 6 numbers and assign as necessary.

Our stats are generally much higher than a typical point buy would allow for.


I think even values is good, but using the same 6 stats assigned to relevant stats I wouldn't want - that would mean Barbarians and Fighters end up with the same strength, and Bards and Rangers end up with the same DEX.


Assuming stats are limited to th odd numbers between 9 and 19, there are only six values to chose from for 12 classes. There will be lots and lots of duplicate values.


That’s true today to.

I’m just saying I don’t favor a proposal like: 17, 15, 13, 11, 11, 11 - assign those 6 numbers to the 6 stats of each character.

I would prefer something like:

Each class has 32 build points, which are used to buy stats at the costs below.

Stats cost:
8 - 0 points
9 - 1
10 - 2
11 - 3
12 - 4
13 - 5
14 - 7
15 - 9
16 - 12
17 - 15

This allows classes to have different stats - especially in their highest stat value, while still being in some kind of balance.


I hate point buy systems like this so much it literally hurts. Elite Grid is the only balanced way, or elite grid + randomized bonuses.


People want to add a point buy to the coaching room?

You hate your coaches, don't you...



Seriously, there just isn't time for this.


I believe the suggestion is for the community to collectively decide how each class would allocate their points for stats, then that single decision is the new base stats for the class. No decisions to be made in coaching, just new character cards with new stats. The reason for doing it is to theoretically balance the classes.
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So, can we fix Thor’s now? 1 year 2 days ago #113

Harlax wrote:

Xavon wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Wade Schwendemann wrote:

valetutto wrote:

Azzy wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Wade Schwendemann wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:
The Great Rebalancing is coming, so I guess we’ll see what happens there.


Are you referring to class specific legendary items, a proposed new set of character cards, or something else?


Character cards. The sum of Druid’s stats is 10 higher than the sum of Cleric’s. (They’re +4 DEX, +4 CON and +2 WIS over Clerics, so I hope that gap gets addressed.)

It’s apparently going to be at least two years before Cleric’s get their legendary.


It's like someone rolled stats for all the classes in lieu of balancing them against one another. XD


Yeah I suspect something like that occurred. some classes got the shaft while others made out like a bandit.
I hope for a point by so they are all even.


Or just take the same 6 numbers and assign as necessary.

Our stats are generally much higher than a typical point buy would allow for.


I think even values is good, but using the same 6 stats assigned to relevant stats I wouldn't want - that would mean Barbarians and Fighters end up with the same strength, and Bards and Rangers end up with the same DEX.


Assuming stats are limited to th odd numbers between 9 and 19, there are only six values to chose from for 12 classes. There will be lots and lots of duplicate values.


That’s true today to.

I’m just saying I don’t favor a proposal like: 17, 15, 13, 11, 11, 11 - assign those 6 numbers to the 6 stats of each character.

I would prefer something like:

Each class has 32 build points, which are used to buy stats at the costs below.

Stats cost:
8 - 0 points
9 - 1
10 - 2
11 - 3
12 - 4
13 - 5
14 - 7
15 - 9
16 - 12
17 - 15

This allows classes to have different stats - especially in their highest stat value, while still being in some kind of balance.


I hate point buy systems like this so much it literally hurts. Elite Grid is the only balanced way, or elite grid + randomized bonuses.


People want to add a point buy to the coaching room?

You hate your coaches, don't you...



Seriously, there just isn't time for this.


I don't think the idea was to add any sort of system for choosing different stats in the coaching room but rather changing the base stats that appear on character cards using a more balanced system- such as point buy.

Edit: looks like someone else said basically the same thing while I was typing this. XD

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Last edit: by Azzy.

So, can we fix Thor’s now? 1 year 2 days ago #114

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Azzy wrote:

Harlax wrote:

Xavon wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Wade Schwendemann wrote:

valetutto wrote:

Azzy wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Wade Schwendemann wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:
The Great Rebalancing is coming, so I guess we’ll see what happens there.


Are you referring to class specific legendary items, a proposed new set of character cards, or something else?


Character cards. The sum of Druid’s stats is 10 higher than the sum of Cleric’s. (They’re +4 DEX, +4 CON and +2 WIS over Clerics, so I hope that gap gets addressed.)

It’s apparently going to be at least two years before Cleric’s get their legendary.


It's like someone rolled stats for all the classes in lieu of balancing them against one another. XD


Yeah I suspect something like that occurred. some classes got the shaft while others made out like a bandit.
I hope for a point by so they are all even.


Or just take the same 6 numbers and assign as necessary.

Our stats are generally much higher than a typical point buy would allow for.


I think even values is good, but using the same 6 stats assigned to relevant stats I wouldn't want - that would mean Barbarians and Fighters end up with the same strength, and Bards and Rangers end up with the same DEX.


Assuming stats are limited to th odd numbers between 9 and 19, there are only six values to chose from for 12 classes. There will be lots and lots of duplicate values.


That’s true today to.

I’m just saying I don’t favor a proposal like: 17, 15, 13, 11, 11, 11 - assign those 6 numbers to the 6 stats of each character.

I would prefer something like:

Each class has 32 build points, which are used to buy stats at the costs below.

Stats cost:
8 - 0 points
9 - 1
10 - 2
11 - 3
12 - 4
13 - 5
14 - 7
15 - 9
16 - 12
17 - 15

This allows classes to have different stats - especially in their highest stat value, while still being in some kind of balance.


I hate point buy systems like this so much it literally hurts. Elite Grid is the only balanced way, or elite grid + randomized bonuses.


People want to add a point buy to the coaching room?

You hate your coaches, don't you...



Seriously, there just isn't time for this.


I don't think the idea was to add any sort of system for choosing different stats in the coaching room but rather changing the base stats that appear on character cards using a more balanced system- such as point buy.

Edit: looks like someone else said basically the same thing while I was typing this. XD


I would never want to coach again if there was a points buy in the coaching room. That said I dont think anyone was asking for it, so much as that new stats be balanced to a point buy system (which I'm ok with either way)
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So, can we fix Thor’s now? 1 year 2 days ago #115

Xavon wrote: I hate point buy systems like this so much it literally hurts. Elite Grid is the only balanced way, or elite grid + randomized bonuses.


I am not familiar with this, and my Google fu is failing me.

Any chance you can describe this, or post a link?
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So, can we fix Thor’s now? 1 year 2 days ago #116

Picc wrote:

Azzy wrote:

Harlax wrote:

Xavon wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Wade Schwendemann wrote:

valetutto wrote:

Azzy wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Wade Schwendemann wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:
The Great Rebalancing is coming, so I guess we’ll see what happens there.


Are you referring to class specific legendary items, a proposed new set of character cards, or something else?


Character cards. The sum of Druid’s stats is 10 higher than the sum of Cleric’s. (They’re +4 DEX, +4 CON and +2 WIS over Clerics, so I hope that gap gets addressed.)

It’s apparently going to be at least two years before Cleric’s get their legendary.


It's like someone rolled stats for all the classes in lieu of balancing them against one another. XD


Yeah I suspect something like that occurred. some classes got the shaft while others made out like a bandit.
I hope for a point by so they are all even.


Or just take the same 6 numbers and assign as necessary.

Our stats are generally much higher than a typical point buy would allow for.


I think even values is good, but using the same 6 stats assigned to relevant stats I wouldn't want - that would mean Barbarians and Fighters end up with the same strength, and Bards and Rangers end up with the same DEX.


Assuming stats are limited to th odd numbers between 9 and 19, there are only six values to chose from for 12 classes. There will be lots and lots of duplicate values.


That’s true today to.

I’m just saying I don’t favor a proposal like: 17, 15, 13, 11, 11, 11 - assign those 6 numbers to the 6 stats of each character.

I would prefer something like:

Each class has 32 build points, which are used to buy stats at the costs below.

Stats cost:
8 - 0 points
9 - 1
10 - 2
11 - 3
12 - 4
13 - 5
14 - 7
15 - 9
16 - 12
17 - 15

This allows classes to have different stats - especially in their highest stat value, while still being in some kind of balance.


I hate point buy systems like this so much it literally hurts. Elite Grid is the only balanced way, or elite grid + randomized bonuses.


People want to add a point buy to the coaching room?

You hate your coaches, don't you...



Seriously, there just isn't time for this.


I don't think the idea was to add any sort of system for choosing different stats in the coaching room but rather changing the base stats that appear on character cards using a more balanced system- such as point buy.

Edit: looks like someone else said basically the same thing while I was typing this. XD


I would never want to coach again if there was a points buy in the coaching room. That said I dont think anyone was asking for it, so much as that new stats be balanced to a point buy system (which I'm ok with either way)


We are talking about how one might rebalance stats on a future set of character cards, nothing to do with coaching.

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So, can we fix Thor’s now? 1 year 2 days ago #117

I'm not following the core concept of how thors hammer and the cleric is now broken. A cleric needs +9 Dex to wield it, which can be acheived a few different ways with 2 tokens. The +5 baton of focus is better in melee damage as well, so really are we just talking about a ranged cleric build that wants the Eldrich kilt that doesnt want to use gloves of the cut purse?

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So, can we fix Thor’s now? 1 year 2 days ago #118

Wade Schwendemann wrote:

Xavon wrote: I hate point buy systems like this so much it literally hurts. Elite Grid is the only balanced way, or elite grid + randomized bonuses.


I am not familiar with this, and my Google fu is failing me.

Any chance you can describe this, or post a link?


I think they might have meant elite array? If so, then that is basically just everyone has a fixed set of attributes to use (15, 14, 13, 12, 10, 8). It tries to make balance via making everyone use identical numbers.

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So, can we fix Thor’s now? 1 year 2 days ago #119

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Azzy wrote:

Wade Schwendemann wrote:

Xavon wrote: I hate point buy systems like this so much it literally hurts. Elite Grid is the only balanced way, or elite grid + randomized bonuses.


I am not familiar with this, and my Google fu is failing me.

Any chance you can describe this, or post a link?


I think they might have meant elite array? If so, then that is basically just everyone has a fixed set of attributes to use (15, 14, 13, 12, 10, 8). It tries to make balance via making everyone use identical numbers.


I am only one person. And yes elite array and elite grid are the same thing. Regional differences. Like pop vs soda.
Applications programming is a race between software engineers, who strive to produce idiot-proof programs, and the Universe, which strives to produce bigger idiots.  <br /><br />So far, the Universe is winning.

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So, can we fix Thor’s now? 1 year 2 days ago #120

Xavon wrote:

Azzy wrote:

Wade Schwendemann wrote:

Xavon wrote: I hate point buy systems like this so much it literally hurts. Elite Grid is the only balanced way, or elite grid + randomized bonuses.


I am not familiar with this, and my Google fu is failing me.

Any chance you can describe this, or post a link?


I think they might have meant elite array? If so, then that is basically just everyone has a fixed set of attributes to use (15, 14, 13, 12, 10, 8). It tries to make balance via making everyone use identical numbers.


I am only one person. And yes elite array and elite grid are the same thing. Regional differences. Like pop vs soda.


I usually just end up going by whatever terminology is in the book- though I guess that was assuming we're doing 3.5 as a general guideline in this instance.

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