TOPIC: 2019 Transmuted Token Images !!

There is one thing that I beg. Can we use the old boots of the Underdark in the recipe for the rogue transmute? Please please please...there are still a few of us who are using these older UR's.

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Lordoftherealm wrote: So clerics cannot use Thor’s for a few years while they were wait for a charm? Is there any harm in that?

No, not at all, there are many, many, many ways Clerics can assemble their necessary +9 DEX:

tokendb.com/stat-bonus/dexterity/

For awesome top tier builds it's probably a choice between:

RoSP or RoSP Segment 6: +1
Ioun Stone Quicksilver Cube and Sphere: +2, +1
The new Kilt: +4
Charm of the Sipquick: +2
Lenses of the Fae: +3
Stu-Pendous Pendant: +3
Exalted Creeper Amulet: +4
Gloves of the Cutpurse: +5
Bracers of Fast Fitness: +2

There are a few dozen much cheaper tokens that are less likely to see play in high end builds.

Of course, many of those knock out things like Charm Necklace or LoDS, or have minuses to STR, making us worse at melee (as Fatherbane does). Can’t have everything...

Yeah - I agree with you - Clerics pay a higher price than anyone else to use this, probably keeping them -2 or -3 STR relative to other classes - which is a bummer.

Just wanted to clarify that it's not the situation that clerics literally can't equip this thing until more DEX boosters get printed.

I agree, and that was never the impression I was trying to give. I’m just saying the latest Eldritch Kilt is clearly better than Tavernbane for those who want the HP, and clearly worse than Fatherbane for those who want the DEX. (Barrelbane isn’t final yet, so who knows about the STR contingent.)

I’d already said in a couple of posts that I could make adjustments to keep Hammer as a Cleric, but thanks for helping to clarify.

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Lordoftherealm wrote: So clerics cannot use Thor’s for a few years while they were wait for a charm? Is there any harm in that?

No, not at all, there are many, many, many ways Clerics can assemble their necessary +9 DEX:

tokendb.com/stat-bonus/dexterity/

For awesome top tier builds it's probably a choice between:

RoSP or RoSP Segment 6: +1
Ioun Stone Quicksilver Cube and Sphere: +2, +1
The new Kilt: +4
Charm of the Sipquick: +2
Lenses of the Fae: +3
Stu-Pendous Pendant: +3
Exalted Creeper Amulet: +4
Gloves of the Cutpurse: +5
Bracers of Fast Fitness: +2

There are a few dozen much cheaper tokens that are less likely to see play in high end builds.

Of course, many of those knock out things like Charm Necklace or LoDS, or have minuses to STR, making us worse at melee (as Fatherbane does). Can’t have everything...

Yeah - I agree with you - Clerics pay a higher price than anyone else to use this, probably keeping them -2 or -3 STR relative to other classes - which is a bummer.

Just wanted to clarify that it's not the situation that clerics literally can't equip this thing until more DEX boosters get printed.

I agree, and that was never the impression I was trying to give. I’m just saying the latest Eldritch Kilt is clearly better than Tavernbane for those who want the HP, and clearly worse than Fatherbane for those who want the DEX. (Barrelbane isn’t final yet, so who knows about the STR contingent.)

I’d already said in a couple of posts that I could make adjustments to keep Hammer as a Cleric, but thanks for helping to clarify.

I never knew Thor was a cleric

Lordoftherealm wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Lordoftherealm wrote: So clerics cannot use Thor’s for a few years while they were wait for a charm? Is there any harm in that?

No, not at all, there are many, many, many ways Clerics can assemble their necessary +9 DEX:

tokendb.com/stat-bonus/dexterity/

For awesome top tier builds it's probably a choice between:

RoSP or RoSP Segment 6: +1
Ioun Stone Quicksilver Cube and Sphere: +2, +1
The new Kilt: +4
Charm of the Sipquick: +2
Lenses of the Fae: +3
Stu-Pendous Pendant: +3
Exalted Creeper Amulet: +4
Gloves of the Cutpurse: +5
Bracers of Fast Fitness: +2

There are a few dozen much cheaper tokens that are less likely to see play in high end builds.

Of course, many of those knock out things like Charm Necklace or LoDS, or have minuses to STR, making us worse at melee (as Fatherbane does). Can’t have everything...

Yeah - I agree with you - Clerics pay a higher price than anyone else to use this, probably keeping them -2 or -3 STR relative to other classes - which is a bummer.

Just wanted to clarify that it's not the situation that clerics literally can't equip this thing until more DEX boosters get printed.

I agree, and that was never the impression I was trying to give. I’m just saying the latest Eldritch Kilt is clearly better than Tavernbane for those who want the HP, and clearly worse than Fatherbane for those who want the DEX. (Barrelbane isn’t final yet, so who knows about the STR contingent.)

I’d already said in a couple of posts that I could make adjustments to keep Hammer as a Cleric, but thanks for helping to clarify.

I never knew Thor was a cleric

Thor is a gawd. You know, those things that Clerics serve.

And Hammers are blunt weapons. You know, the only kind of weapon that clerics are allowed to use. In fact, Thor’s is the ONLY legendary weapon we’re allowed to even touch, other than our Baton. Fangs, bows, swords, cleavers - nope.

And we’re the only class that can’t use this year’s crossbow. Which is fine. Slings and throwing hammers are all we’ve got, and there are no legendary slings.

The fact we’re the single class that has the hardest time wielding the thing makes no sense to me whatsoever. Never did.

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Lordoftherealm wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Lordoftherealm wrote: So clerics cannot use Thor’s for a few years while they were wait for a charm? Is there any harm in that?

No, not at all, there are many, many, many ways Clerics can assemble their necessary +9 DEX:

tokendb.com/stat-bonus/dexterity/

For awesome top tier builds it's probably a choice between:

RoSP or RoSP Segment 6: +1
Ioun Stone Quicksilver Cube and Sphere: +2, +1
The new Kilt: +4
Charm of the Sipquick: +2
Lenses of the Fae: +3
Stu-Pendous Pendant: +3
Exalted Creeper Amulet: +4
Gloves of the Cutpurse: +5
Bracers of Fast Fitness: +2

There are a few dozen much cheaper tokens that are less likely to see play in high end builds.

Of course, many of those knock out things like Charm Necklace or LoDS, or have minuses to STR, making us worse at melee (as Fatherbane does). Can’t have everything...

Yeah - I agree with you - Clerics pay a higher price than anyone else to use this, probably keeping them -2 or -3 STR relative to other classes - which is a bummer.

Just wanted to clarify that it's not the situation that clerics literally can't equip this thing until more DEX boosters get printed.

I agree, and that was never the impression I was trying to give. I’m just saying the latest Eldritch Kilt is clearly better than Tavernbane for those who want the HP, and clearly worse than Fatherbane for those who want the DEX. (Barrelbane isn’t final yet, so who knows about the STR contingent.)

I’d already said in a couple of posts that I could make adjustments to keep Hammer as a Cleric, but thanks for helping to clarify.

I never knew Thor was a cleric

Thor is a gawd. You know, those things that Clerics serve.

And Hammers are blunt weapons. You know, the only kind of weapon that clerics are allowed to use. In fact, Thor’s is the ONLY legendary weapon we’re allowed to even touch, other than our Baton. Fangs, bows, swords, cleavers - nope.

And we’re the only class that can’t use this year’s crossbow. Which is fine. Slings and throwing hammers are all we’ve got, and there are no legendary slings.

The fact we’re the single class that has the hardest time wielding the thing makes no sense to me whatsoever. Never did.

It is funny that clerics cannot use edged weapons. Why? Because they do not like drawing blood? Or do not like looking at it? Here have some internal bleeding, oh and, don't get any on my clothes.

Lordoftherealm wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Lordoftherealm wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Lordoftherealm wrote: So clerics cannot use Thor’s for a few years while they were wait for a charm? Is there any harm in that?

No, not at all, there are many, many, many ways Clerics can assemble their necessary +9 DEX:

tokendb.com/stat-bonus/dexterity/

For awesome top tier builds it's probably a choice between:

RoSP or RoSP Segment 6: +1
Ioun Stone Quicksilver Cube and Sphere: +2, +1
The new Kilt: +4
Charm of the Sipquick: +2
Lenses of the Fae: +3
Stu-Pendous Pendant: +3
Exalted Creeper Amulet: +4
Gloves of the Cutpurse: +5
Bracers of Fast Fitness: +2

There are a few dozen much cheaper tokens that are less likely to see play in high end builds.

Of course, many of those knock out things like Charm Necklace or LoDS, or have minuses to STR, making us worse at melee (as Fatherbane does). Can’t have everything...

Yeah - I agree with you - Clerics pay a higher price than anyone else to use this, probably keeping them -2 or -3 STR relative to other classes - which is a bummer.

Just wanted to clarify that it's not the situation that clerics literally can't equip this thing until more DEX boosters get printed.

I agree, and that was never the impression I was trying to give. I’m just saying the latest Eldritch Kilt is clearly better than Tavernbane for those who want the HP, and clearly worse than Fatherbane for those who want the DEX. (Barrelbane isn’t final yet, so who knows about the STR contingent.)

I’d already said in a couple of posts that I could make adjustments to keep Hammer as a Cleric, but thanks for helping to clarify.

I never knew Thor was a cleric

Thor is a gawd. You know, those things that Clerics serve.

And Hammers are blunt weapons. You know, the only kind of weapon that clerics are allowed to use. In fact, Thor’s is the ONLY legendary weapon we’re allowed to even touch, other than our Baton. Fangs, bows, swords, cleavers - nope.

And we’re the only class that can’t use this year’s crossbow. Which is fine. Slings and throwing hammers are all we’ve got, and there are no legendary slings.

The fact we’re the single class that has the hardest time wielding the thing makes no sense to me whatsoever. Never did.

It is funny that clerics cannot use edged weapons. Why? Because they do not like drawing blood? Or do not like looking at it? Here have some internal bleeding, oh and, don't get any on my clothes.

I know. I’ve seen Walking Dead. Hit someone in the head with a bat or a hammer and there will be blood...

Hey, I don’t make the rules.

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Lordoftherealm wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Lordoftherealm wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Lordoftherealm wrote: So clerics cannot use Thor’s for a few years while they were wait for a charm? Is there any harm in that?

No, not at all, there are many, many, many ways Clerics can assemble their necessary +9 DEX:

tokendb.com/stat-bonus/dexterity/

For awesome top tier builds it's probably a choice between:

RoSP or RoSP Segment 6: +1
Ioun Stone Quicksilver Cube and Sphere: +2, +1
The new Kilt: +4
Charm of the Sipquick: +2
Lenses of the Fae: +3
Stu-Pendous Pendant: +3
Exalted Creeper Amulet: +4
Gloves of the Cutpurse: +5
Bracers of Fast Fitness: +2

There are a few dozen much cheaper tokens that are less likely to see play in high end builds.

Of course, many of those knock out things like Charm Necklace or LoDS, or have minuses to STR, making us worse at melee (as Fatherbane does). Can’t have everything...

Yeah - I agree with you - Clerics pay a higher price than anyone else to use this, probably keeping them -2 or -3 STR relative to other classes - which is a bummer.

Just wanted to clarify that it's not the situation that clerics literally can't equip this thing until more DEX boosters get printed.

I agree, and that was never the impression I was trying to give. I’m just saying the latest Eldritch Kilt is clearly better than Tavernbane for those who want the HP, and clearly worse than Fatherbane for those who want the DEX. (Barrelbane isn’t final yet, so who knows about the STR contingent.)

I’d already said in a couple of posts that I could make adjustments to keep Hammer as a Cleric, but thanks for helping to clarify.

I never knew Thor was a cleric

Thor is a gawd. You know, those things that Clerics serve.

And Hammers are blunt weapons. You know, the only kind of weapon that clerics are allowed to use. In fact, Thor’s is the ONLY legendary weapon we’re allowed to even touch, other than our Baton. Fangs, bows, swords, cleavers - nope.

And we’re the only class that can’t use this year’s crossbow. Which is fine. Slings and throwing hammers are all we’ve got, and there are no legendary slings.

The fact we’re the single class that has the hardest time wielding the thing makes no sense to me whatsoever. Never did.

It is funny that clerics cannot use edged weapons. Why? Because they do not like drawing blood? Or do not like looking at it? Here have some internal bleeding, oh and, don't get any on my clothes.

I know. I’ve seen Walking Dead. Hit someone in the head with a bat or a hammer and there will be blood...

Hey, I don’t make the rules.

Priestly types preferring blunt weapons is a commonly accepted trope that predates D&D. It is semi-factually linked back to depictions of a famous bishop fighting in the battle of Hastings.

Brad Mortensen wrote: The fact we’re the single class that has the hardest time wielding the thing makes no sense to me whatsoever. Never did.

Something to vouch for when class cards are supposedly being redesigned for 2020.

Phil Norton wrote: I will echo the sentiment of returning the kilt to 5. This will add the HP at level 5 anyway, and is less of a gap for STR and DEX users to overcome.

Kilt needs a star icon
Legendary lute needs hands icon
Legendaries need year icon removed

I feel like this has been buried. Trying to highlight it again.

Kakitahan wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote: The fact we’re the single class that has the hardest time wielding the thing makes no sense to me whatsoever. Never did.

Something to vouch for when class cards are supposedly being redesigned for 2020.

Maybe. Or, fix the Hammer. But I think I agree with you in that this became a distraction.

Thor’s doesn’t cause the Kilt problem, it just highlights it.

Anyway, I guess the immediate goal of this is to figure out a way to make the Eldritch Kilt better than any of the three Kilts, not just one of them. That, or let the Eld be worse than all three.

Put another way current design is mathematically the same as “+2 CON -1 FORT, then +4 to STR, DEX, or CON”

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Kakitahan wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote: The fact we’re the single class that has the hardest time wielding the thing makes no sense to me whatsoever. Never did.

Something to vouch for when class cards are supposedly being redesigned for 2020.

Maybe. Or, fix the Hammer. But I think I agree with you in that this became a distraction.

Thor’s doesn’t cause the Kilt problem, it just highlights it.

Anyway, I guess the immediate goal of this is to figure out a way to make the Eldritch Kilt better than any of the three Kilts, not just one of them. That, or let the Eld be worse than all three.

To your specific class build it may not be better but based on the overall numbers it's a better Token than any of the three UR Kilts. +4 total stat increase vs either +2, or +0. +5 additional HP vs +0 HP. Eldritch vs. Non-Eldritch set. Sorry numbers are numbers. It's better.

Rob F wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Kakitahan wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote: The fact we’re the single class that has the hardest time wielding the thing makes no sense to me whatsoever. Never did.

Something to vouch for when class cards are supposedly being redesigned for 2020.

Maybe. Or, fix the Hammer. But I think I agree with you in that this became a distraction.

Thor’s doesn’t cause the Kilt problem, it just highlights it.

Anyway, I guess the immediate goal of this is to figure out a way to make the Eldritch Kilt better than any of the three Kilts, not just one of them. That, or let the Eld be worse than all three.

To your specific class build it may not be better but based on the overall numbers it's a better Token than any of the three UR Kilts. +4 total stat increase vs either +2, or +0. +5 additional HP vs +0 HP. Eldritch vs. Non-Eldritch set. Sorry numbers are numbers. It's better.

How about we make it “choose a stat to be +1, then +100 CHA” then it will be the best token in history.

Because math, since you’re apparently assuming all stats are equally valuable for everyone.

Let’s define terms.

When I say “better,” I mean that you would always use it instead of one of the components.

I’m not the only one in this discussion who has said they would wear Fatherbane over the Eld Kilt. By my definition, that means the Eld Kilt is NOT better than Fatherbane, whatever the numbers say.

You’re using a different definition of “better,” which is why we don’t agree.