TOPIC: Notes about Tokens for 2019

Grekel! wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Grekel! wrote: I've been thinking about the wand situation. And I rarely use wands these days... I hate seeing them get consumed in one shot... but then again it is not really one single shot... it's kind of like a repeating scroll...

that said...

I wonder (yeah Ima get pounded for being greedy, but that's ok)

Would it be possible to get a "wand as free action" UR or Legendary...? I'd be ok if it was a little bit blood magic like the MEC.... That way you could tag on the wand effect as a bit of "flavour" to spice up your standard spell casting....

Just a thought...

But overall - I get the reasoning behind the changes... and it does make sense.

Your token wish has been granted?

tokendb.com/token/medallion-of-mystic-mouth/

I get that - But after I read the way it applies to the new wand rules... it seems that if I were to say "I'm casting and using the MoMM to use a wand as a free action as well"... I don't think it works that way - does it?

If it does then I retract my request...

It does, you just have to turn in the wand at the end of the room, which is new this year.

Grekel! wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Grekel! wrote: I've been thinking about the wand situation. And I rarely use wands these days... I hate seeing them get consumed in one shot... but then again it is not really one single shot... it's kind of like a repeating scroll...

that said...

I wonder (yeah Ima get pounded for being greedy, but that's ok)

Would it be possible to get a "wand as free action" UR or Legendary...? I'd be ok if it was a little bit blood magic like the MEC.... That way you could tag on the wand effect as a bit of "flavour" to spice up your standard spell casting....

Just a thought...

But overall - I get the reasoning behind the changes... and it does make sense.

Your token wish has been granted?

tokendb.com/token/medallion-of-mystic-mouth/

I get that - But after I read the way it applies to the new wand rules... it seems that if I were to say "I'm casting and using the MoMM to use a wand as a free action as well"... I don't think it works that way - does it?

If it does then I retract my request...

I think that’s exactly how Mystic Mouth works. In 2017, I would cast with main action and punch a wand with free action. In 2018, I currently cast with main action and put a wand on the table each round with free action (reclaiming all wands at the end of combat). Now in 2019, it sounds like we can still cast with main action and put a wand on the table with free action - but we only need to use one wand per room, which we won’t ever get back. (Of course this assumes cast and blast each round. If we want to instead forego casting and use a wand blast with both the main and free actions, two wand tokens will be required.)

Rob F wrote:

Grekel! wrote:

kurtreznor wrote:

Jeff Martin wrote: SPECIAL NOTE about Relics and Legendaries

Now that every class has at least a few generic legendary tokens, starting in 2019 we will be producing class specific ones. Every Relic and Legendary class specific token, barring some thematic exceptions will occupy the neck slot so as not to interfere with any previous Eldritch items. The two classes that will not be in the neck slot are the Bard and Paladin. This puts all the classes on a roughly even slot impact basis. I hope you like the new 2019 legendaries for the Bard, Druid, & Rogue! Next year we plan on Neck slot items for the Barbarian, Monk and Ranger -- while the +2 Holy Avenger (from 2019) can be transmuted up to a +5 Holy Avenger! We wanted to add the +2 Holy Avenger in this year -- since Paladins will be venturing into the Infernal Pit!

oldschoolfrp.tumblr.com/image/125089241577

all neck slot? that sounds terrible. unless some of the relic level items are just bad, every single neck slot UR will become crap over the next few years. for a slot that was always touted as the premier slot and given some of the best URs, this is awful. I can see some of the classes being given their legendary in the neck slot; and the other half of the classes can trade for their now-unused neck URs. maybe the other half can have a specific slot selected for their special item; perhaps back slot?

The neck slot does present a real source of potential anguish for many players... but eventually you're going to have to give up something... I do agree that neck seems very "pricey" if you will... but then, for me so does back...

Yes. At some point everyone is going to have to give up something. No way around it.

yes, of course each person will have to give up something, what I was trying to get at was that the something that I pass on when I upgrade to relic/legendary class item will be the same slot that EVERYONE gives up when they make that upgrade. the result will be a glut of UR neck slot items that no one wants. what bothers me the most is that these old UR neck items are some of the best BECAUSE they are neck items.

on the other hand, if only half the class special items are neck slot, then you still have half the players with a desire to use all those amazing UR neck items. sure, lots of medallion of Valhalla, stu's pendant, charm necklace and so on will become available, but so long as enough players aren't getting a special neck slot item, they will still want those and trade for them.

...it now occurs to me that jeff could always include 'any UR neck item' as part of the recipe for these, both lowering the cost of other ingredients to transmute AND sucking up all those neck slot items that wont get used. still not sure I like it yet...I will let it simmer while I sleep.

also, darn you jeff, I said I needed sleep tonight.

kurtreznor wrote: what I was trying to get at was that the something that I pass on when I upgrade to relic/legendary class item will be the same slot that EVERYONE gives up when they make that upgrade. the result will be a glut of UR neck slot items that no one wants.

I suspect you'll find there's a decent sized market of non-legendary level people interested in buying the no longer BIS neck items. I would bet most would land in upper end of the $50-100 range in the resale market.

That said, it probably won't be me as I'm stuck with amulet of treasure finding in that slot for the next 8 or 10 years I think.

Grekel! wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Grekel! wrote: I've been thinking about the wand situation. And I rarely use wands these days... I hate seeing them get consumed in one shot... but then again it is not really one single shot... it's kind of like a repeating scroll...

that said...

I wonder (yeah Ima get pounded for being greedy, but that's ok)

Would it be possible to get a "wand as free action" UR or Legendary...? I'd be ok if it was a little bit blood magic like the MEC.... That way you could tag on the wand effect as a bit of "flavour" to spice up your standard spell casting....

Just a thought...

But overall - I get the reasoning behind the changes... and it does make sense.

Your token wish has been granted?

tokendb.com/token/medallion-of-mystic-mouth/

I get that - But after I read the way it applies to the new wand rules... it seems that if I were to say "I'm casting and using the MoMM to use a wand as a free action as well"... I don't think it works that way - does it?

If it does then I retract my request...

I'm not sure what you mean?

The MMM has always worked, and I see no suggestion it would change, this way:

As a free action, ready a wand in your hand, use the wand, and return your hands to whatever state they were in before the readying.


The change to wands makes them consumable, why would it change how MMM functions? (MMM functions that way with both consumable and nonconsumable wands)

James J Krot wrote: I still will be keeping my lens of divine sight. I wish jeff could punch them or something so I could still keep the old token instead of just turning it in.

I second this... as a token collector i will keep one of the old tokens but would be nice to be able to use it with new rules... it isn’t like they are doing the trade-in to discourage counterfeiting?

I will trade in my second one since this probably killed the resell ability at the price I paid... oh well, I did have fun using it for a couple of years

Wade Schwendemann wrote: Pretty please, have one of the holy avenger recipes include Welfor's

+infinity!

Jeff Martin wrote: SPECIAL NOTE about Relics and Legendaries

Now that every class has at least a few generic legendary tokens, starting in 2019 we will be producing class specific ones. Every Relic and Legendary class specific token, barring some thematic exceptions will occupy the neck slot so as not to interfere with any previous Eldritch items. The two classes that will not be in the neck slot are the Bard and Paladin. This puts all the classes on a roughly even slot impact basis. I hope you like the new 2019 legendaries for the Bard, Druid, & Rogue! Next year we plan on Neck slot items for the Barbarian, Monk and Ranger -- while the +2 Holy Avenger (from 2019) can be transmuted up to a +5 Holy Avenger! We wanted to add the +2 Holy Avenger in this year -- since Paladins will be venturing into the Infernal Pit!

On behalf of all the Paladins I know (particularly the ones who have protected my undeserving butt) I thank you for the Holy Avenger transmute path!!

(Pali's are generally too polite to make a ruckus on the forum when they don't get what they want... but I've seen passionate requests for this for years now. They just tend to get drown out by the Rogues and Wizards and Druids and Monks etc. who all claim to need the most token love ; )

kurtreznor wrote:

Jeff Martin wrote: SPECIAL NOTE about Relics and Legendaries

Now that every class has at least a few generic legendary tokens, starting in 2019 we will be producing class specific ones. Every Relic and Legendary class specific token, barring some thematic exceptions will occupy the neck slot so as not to interfere with any previous Eldritch items. The two classes that will not be in the neck slot are the Bard and Paladin. This puts all the classes on a roughly even slot impact basis. I hope you like the new 2019 legendaries for the Bard, Druid, & Rogue! Next year we plan on Neck slot items for the Barbarian, Monk and Ranger -- while the +2 Holy Avenger (from 2019) can be transmuted up to a +5 Holy Avenger! We wanted to add the +2 Holy Avenger in this year -- since Paladins will be venturing into the Infernal Pit!

oldschoolfrp.tumblr.com/image/125089241577

all neck slot? that sounds terrible. unless some of the relic level items are just bad, every single neck slot UR will become crap over the next few years. for a slot that was always touted as the premier slot and given some of the best URs, this is awful. I can see some of the classes being given their legendary in the neck slot; and the other half of the classes can trade for their now-unused neck URs. maybe the other half can have a specific slot selected for their special item; perhaps back slot?

That's a good point. Although, there's probably a significant portion of the player base that won't get the class specific Relic or Legendary, so those players will still have a use for UR neck slot items. Also, using Druids for example, anyone new to the game starting a couple of years from now will have missed the window to ever get the class specific token, other than through the secondary market.

Mongo wrote:

James J Krot wrote: I still will be keeping my lens of divine sight. I wish jeff could punch them or something so I could still keep the old token instead of just turning it in.

I second this... as a token collector i will keep one of the old tokens but would be nice to be able to use it with new rules... it isn’t like they are doing the trade-in to discourage counterfeiting?

I will trade in my second one since this probably killed the resell ability at the price I paid... oh well, I did have fun using it for a couple of years

I'll definitely trade in all five of mine (the two we're using and the three in my store). I haven't decided how many I'll trade for the new version and how many for a PYP. I'm leaning towards maybe one new version for our Cleric and four PYP. Or maybe all five PYP. Even with the +2 healing the LoDS is just a shadow of it's former self.

Jeff, regarding the Shaman tokens notes, the UR now has free action (which I think is appropriate).

Can the air elemental form for all three rarities be a ranged attack? That seems fitting for an air elemental, and gives it more flavor than just damage prevention.

Thanks,
Mike

I dislike the move to the neck slot for a slightly different reason.

The neck slot is one place we actually see some diversity in high-end builds. Does someone choose to use Charm Necklace? Or something that adds directly to stats? Or a UR TE? Or maybe something else entirely?

Now that diversity shrinks at the top end. I'd rather have seen the Rogue item move to the hood rather than this outcome.

Or, since Paladin and Bard seem locked in to items you hold in your hands, why not just use that slot for everyone?