TOPIC: Reviews and feedback

Ro-gan wrote:


I was running my Medusa where the mirrors worked for everything if it was Non-Lethal and Normal. For HC and NM the mirror may or may not work for combat. It depends if I remembered or not and the experience/Token level of the Players. If they were sliding Relics/Legendaries? The mirror didn't work in combat situations.

I normally don't like to call people out but that sounds horrible. Gear level shouldn't be a barometer for if something works or not. Even putting aside the montra of consistency TD strives for that's a huge dis-incentive to want to gear up.

Ro-gan wrote:


If a Party or some of the Party came into my Room already with the mirror ready and up? They had to automatically save versus the Medusa. Why? There was absolutely no clue or suspicion this was a Medusa Room. Not until she started dancing behind the screen. Guess what? They had prior knowledge and were using non-Player related knowledge to take advantage of the Room. Save. You can cheat if you want. But, I catch you, Save.

Again wow, I didn't know if we were going to see a Medusa or not but I walked into every room with my mirror held up in front of me. Its a snake temple Sending the mirror in first isnt cheating its common sense for anyone whose ever played D&D and were supposed to be lv 4/5.

Ro-gan wrote:

I let one woman go because she explained she uses the mirror every year, every Room. She convinced me and, oddly enough, sold me a bridge. LOL!!

By Friday night, it go to the point everyone coming into my Room automatically turned their backs when the Medusa started dancing or before she started dancing behind the screen. So, Saturday morning my Medusa came up with a great idea to enter the Room a different way almost every time. It was so funny to see the "cheaters" jump when the Medusa would come in the Room in front of them when they had their backs to the Medusa's screen.

My Medusa (both that I worked with over the course of 3 days) and I were hiding Scroll Stone To Flesh Tokens throughout the Room. Heck! If the Party wasn't even searching the Room after combat and had newbies to TD turned to stone statues I would toss a Scroll Stone To Flesh on the combat board or floor and say: "someone dropped a Token."

I didn't have an infinite amount of Scrolls StF so if a Party had some turned to stone when time was up there was nothing I could do. Although, sometimes my Medusa would be told she can turn them back if they weren't suitable for her Room because of (insert reason).

My Medusa (both) and I tried so hard to make people happy. But, you can't make everyone happy and I was able to live with that.

Oh! Here's a thing I got a lot from people in combat using mirrors:

Me: "You hit the Medusa... save for me, please."

Player: <angrily> "I have a mirror."

Me: "You are using a 2-Handed weapon. You can't use a mirror and your weapon at the same time <very friendly smile from me>."

9.99/10 they totally understood.

I get that your trying to make people happy (and you likely did, I didnt have any issues with the room either time I went through) but depending on how serious you were being above I think you may have made the wrong call by messing with players you though were "cheating".

Raywind wrote: Spreading out the push damage is a silly idea. It means even if you did the room correctly, you're still taking damage.

Why is it silly?

It simply adds a time component, so there are varying degrees of success. Instead of a binary "did you solve it or not?" there is the issue of "how long did it take for you to solve it?"

It certainly creates a different dynamic. But I'd hardly call it "silly."

travis wrote:

Arcanist Kolixela wrote: The viper gas room I STILL believe to be broken.

Both runs I did with that room we found one of the tubes stopped getting air after about 5 connections were made.

We got to 9 of 10 tubes in the second run with those of us who'd run before pushing directly into the puzzle.

Either the puzzle was broken or you are supposed to figure out there are tubes not in use. I don't see that happening with the design.

what day of the con did it stop working? i know it was working for us on our run friday night.

It also worked for us on Sunday... actually it was the only time we got it solved.

Chris Von Wahlde wrote:

travis wrote:

Arcanist Kolixela wrote: The viper gas room I STILL believe to be broken.

Both runs I did with that room we found one of the tubes stopped getting air after about 5 connections were made.

We got to 9 of 10 tubes in the second run with those of us who'd run before pushing directly into the puzzle.

Either the puzzle was broken or you are supposed to figure out there are tubes not in use. I don't see that happening with the design.

what day of the con did it stop working? i know it was working for us on our run friday night.

It also worked for us on Sunday... actually it was the only time we got it solved.

There were several copies of that room right?

I was on a Zephyr combat run Thursday afternoon and Friday Night, we failed it both runs and both times I found air leaking through one of the pipes, and both times one of the early connections stopped having air going through it. I have to assume the air leakage is what lead to us not being able to complete the puzzle either time and that's upsetting for a treasure room.

Incognito wrote:

Raywind wrote: Spreading out the push damage is a silly idea. It means even if you did the room correctly, you're still taking damage.

Why is it silly?

It simply adds a time component, so there are varying degrees of success. Instead of a binary "did you solve it or not?" there is the issue of "how long did it take for you to solve it?"

It certainly creates a different dynamic. But I'd hardly call it "silly."

I agree... personally I liked the time constraint push damage. I thought it added a little more sense of urgency to these rooms.
I could see it affect a newer group negatively though. Maybe only use it on Hardcore and Nightmare.

Chris Von Wahlde wrote:

Incognito wrote:

Raywind wrote: Spreading out the push damage is a silly idea. It means even if you did the room correctly, you're still taking damage.

Why is it silly?

It simply adds a time component, so there are varying degrees of success. Instead of a binary "did you solve it or not?" there is the issue of "how long did it take for you to solve it?"

It certainly creates a different dynamic. But I'd hardly call it "silly."

I agree... personally I liked the time constraint push damage. I thought it added a little more sense of urgency to these rooms.
I could see it affect a newer group negatively though. Maybe only use it on Hardcore and Nightmare.

The biggest problem was that it distracted people from the puzzle. Everyone stopped working on the puzzle and started healing. Maybe split it in two and move the first hit to 8 minutes and then the second at the 1 to go minute mark.

Most have said it better than me, so I will keep my feedback short. I don't remember what each room was off the top of my head, so I will list what I remember from each.

Zephyr (combat and puzzle)
1. loved the Hawk-kin NPCs and that they stayed with you for multiple rooms.
2. I was not completely happy with the puzzles here. I think maybe too complex in their builds, which led to alot of technical difficulties throughout the weekend. I'm also not a fan of random puzzles, so the switch puzzle I thought was pointless. In a time sensitive situation a puzzle should have a solution that can be thought through worked out... not just flicking switches.
3. Combat was good. Air elemental was nice if not a bit easy (my groups could have just gotten lucky). I really liked room 7 and the 2 part fight/puzzle... however the DMs really need to make sure that they are explaining what peopleare volunteering for.

Viper (puzzle/combat)
1. Once again the NPCs were wonderful in this dungeon... especially the Medusa and Drow.
2. Loved the puzzles.. however once again the complexity in a couple led to problems I believe. The sand puzzle while having a great effect was too glitchy.
3. I loved room 7 on both sides. Combat had a nice multi tier fight, not to mention the Sneaky Drow (nice addition). In one of my runs as an Elf Wizard I even had her seek me out so she could attack her pale skinned cousin. Room 7 puzzle (I DMd this room on Thursday), was well thought out. It was hilarious to see groups who figured out the plates get that confused look on their faces when the couldn't figure out it was a 2 parter.

Overall very enjoyable weekend. My 2 biggest crtique would be...
1. Less complex puzzle builds, so there will be less glitches throughout the weekend.
2. There needs to be more consistency with the DMs. Way to many instances of things working in one run, but not in another.

cdsmith wrote:

Chris Von Wahlde wrote:

Incognito wrote:

Raywind wrote: Spreading out the push damage is a silly idea. It means even if you did the room correctly, you're still taking damage.

Why is it silly?

It simply adds a time component, so there are varying degrees of success. Instead of a binary "did you solve it or not?" there is the issue of "how long did it take for you to solve it?"

It certainly creates a different dynamic. But I'd hardly call it "silly."

I agree... personally I liked the time constraint push damage. I thought it added a little more sense of urgency to these rooms.
I could see it affect a newer group negatively though. Maybe only use it on Hardcore and Nightmare.

The biggest problem was that it distracted people from the puzzle. Everyone stopped working on the puzzle and started healing. Maybe split it in two and move the first hit to 8 minutes and then the second at the 1 to go minute mark.

I guess I never had a problem, as we didn't heal until after we solved the puzzle. I could definitely see them changing when the effect happens. Again maybe losing it all together on normal mode, and changing the time could work better.

Arcanist Kolixela wrote:

Chris Von Wahlde wrote:

travis wrote:

Arcanist Kolixela wrote: The viper gas room I STILL believe to be broken.

Both runs I did with that room we found one of the tubes stopped getting air after about 5 connections were made.

We got to 9 of 10 tubes in the second run with those of us who'd run before pushing directly into the puzzle.

Either the puzzle was broken or you are supposed to figure out there are tubes not in use. I don't see that happening with the design.

what day of the con did it stop working? i know it was working for us on our run friday night.

It also worked for us on Sunday... actually it was the only time we got it solved.

There were several copies of that room right?

I was on a Zephyr combat run Thursday afternoon and Friday Night, we failed it both runs and both times I found air leaking through one of the pipes, and both times one of the early connections stopped having air going through it. I have to assume the air leakage is what lead to us not being able to complete the puzzle either time and that's upsetting for a treasure room.

we completed it on the puzzle side on thursday during the 5:01pm run and on friday during the 5:12pm run. so at least for us, both sides were working at those particular times.

i know when we were running it, some people were swapping out tubes that were already correct (without letting people know that they were doing it), causing tubes further down the line to stop working and confusing the crap out of us until we realized what they were doing.

cdsmith wrote: The biggest problem was that it distracted people from the puzzle. Everyone stopped working on the puzzle and started healing. Maybe split it in two and move the first hit to 8 minutes and then the second at the 1 to go minute mark.

that was really the only issue i had with it. i think i actually liked the new mechanic (when it makes sense for the room). there are definitely situations when a large push damage at the end would make more sense, and vice-versa.

i think one way to avoid the distraction of stopping the puzzle to adjust your HP would be to have the DM announce that everyone is taking X points of damage but that he will keep track of the total so that you can take it off at the end of the room/when you solve the puzzle as long as you have more than that many HPs to not die.

personally i was just keeping track of it in my head and adjusting it at the end of the room anyway so i wouldnt have to stop in the middle of the puzzle.

I haven't run TD since I began volunteering, so my feedback only corresponds with Room 6 Zephyr Puzzle which I GM'd all week. I had a blast again, but there was a noticeable level of frustration for a large majority of the parties that ran through the dungeon. "Shit. Tubes again?" was an oft muttered comment as groups entered the room. From my side of things, I understand the frustration with trying to connect all the tubes in the allotted amount of time -- ~12 minutes is pressing anyone to get through that. However, on the TD side of things, I really enjoyed the mechanics of it and that it pressed the groups to think about the puzzle in a different way. There were a lot of unique approaches to it throughout the weekend.

The few times there were technical difficulties with the hoses (air not blowing out more so than the two PVC joints that would fall out/hose clamps coming undone) were frustrating on my end of things, but I did what I could to accommodate getting everything in working order while the ACs or Techs came to fix them (I haven't mentioned this, but Brian and Jeanette [sp] are stellar coordinates -- I've worked with them the last two years as well and they're always on top of their game when it comes to anything that springs up. And the Techs were fantastic about checking with me/what needed to be fixed based on what I was keeping an eye on.) I do want to throw it out there as well that whenever anyone raised a question about the hoses themselves, I made sure to check them. None of the minute leaks effected the outcome of the puzzle while I was in there -- I troubleshot it during one of my bubbles because I was concerned about that as well. In conjunction with that, there were only 3-4 groups that entered the room when there was a technical issue that impeded them working on the the puzzle out to completion, and I made sure that it wasn't a factor that would debilitate their chance to get a treasure stamp based on a faulty machine (although one of these groups came in with a Troubador Bard that sang for treasure before they even started the puzzle, then solved it as the horn blew even with the technical problem).

All of that said, I had several groups that ran through the room that could not complete it in time but thanked me because they had a great time trying to figure it out once they started to understand the ways it could work out (including several people who told me that they really enjoyed the puzzle even though it was so difficult).

Mitch wrote: I haven't run TD since I began volunteering, so my feedback only corresponds with Room 6 Zephyr Puzzle which I GM'd all week. I had a blast again, but there was a noticeable level of frustration for a large majority of the parties that ran through the dungeon. "Shit. Tubes again?" was an oft muttered comment as groups entered the room. From my side of things, I understand the frustration with trying to connect all the tubes in the allotted amount of time -- ~12 minutes is pressing anyone to get through that. However, on the TD side of things, I really enjoyed the mechanics of it and that it pressed the groups to think about the puzzle in a different way. There were a lot of unique approaches to it throughout the weekend.

The few times there were technical difficulties with the hoses (air not blowing out more so than the two PVC joints that would fall out/hose clamps coming undone) were frustrating on my end of things, but I did what I could to accommodate getting everything in working order while the ACs or Techs came to fix them (I haven't mentioned this, but Brian and Jeanette [sp] are stellar coordinates -- I've worked with them the last two years as well and they're always on top of their game when it comes to anything that springs up. And the Techs were fantastic about checking with me/what needed to be fixed based on what I was keeping an eye on.) I do want to throw it out there as well that whenever anyone raised a question about the hoses themselves, I made sure to check them. None of the minute leaks effected the outcome of the puzzle while I was in there -- I troubleshot it during one of my bubbles because I was concerned about that as well.

All of that said, I had several groups that ran through the room that could not complete it in time but thanked me because they had a great time trying to figure it out once they started to understand the ways it could work out (including several people who told me that they really enjoyed the puzzle even though it was so difficult).

Had we actually HAD 12 minutes to solve the puzzle I would have been fine with it. We didn't. Given the *IMO completely unecessary* 20 on 20 off BS you had just under 6 minutes to complete the puzzle. One bad decision from the group and you were done. One person not checking fast enough and you were done. Spending HALF of the puzzle standing around doing NOTHING while waiting to be able to turn it back on and ACTUALLY DO SOMETHING was an extreme Negative Play Experience.

Had it not been a treasure room and had the tubes not been leaking air, and had the DM of the room been given the solution to verify if things weren't working I would have been OK with it. But Mechanical issues coupled with DMs not being able to verify functionality and loss of numerous treasure pulls just really made the run extremely negative for me.