TOPIC: New Completion token: Belt of the brave

Speaking of good completion Tokens, What happened to Earcuff of Enlightenment or bracers of the tavernkeeper? Both of those were high on my groups list and if they aren’t in 2021, are they just gone?

Endgame wrote: Speaking of good completion Tokens, What happened to Earcuff of Enlightenment or bracers of the tavernkeeper? Both of those were high on my groups list and if they aren’t in 2021, are they just gone?

We still have 3 more VTD modules to go. Any of those could get multiple weekends with unique completion tokens.

jedibcg Banjo 5150 Lover wrote: This token has to be the new baseline for the UR melee belt. If it isn't WHY would anyone get it? Seriously. If you have this belt and Hill Giant belt is reprinted are you telling me you going to 'upgrade' to the UR?

I most likely would not buy a Girdle of Hill Giant Strength , unless I was playing a build using thrown weapons. If the Girdle of Hill Giant Strength is reprinted in the next few years, it would likely need to be part of a set to make it attractive. A Death Knight Belt of Strength (+3 strength & part of the Death Knight set) would probable be popular.

I kind of see this as a good thing though, as i would rather see something else in the belt slot other than strength at the UR level in the next few years.

Also to be clear I do think this item is powerful and likely should not have been created at the rare level. I just don't think it is a game breaker.

Tokendb still says there are 15 completion tokens for 2020 so even if there isn't an a and b. we have 8 of them in V1a, V1b, V2a, V2b. That would only mean 1 completion token wouldn't make the rotation. My guess would be Shirt of Shielding (2020), but anything is possible.

OrionW wrote: It is OK for there to be some tokens that are a more powerful than expected

Agreed. I am fine with the occasional overpowered completion token. I think this one is fine. I do feel for those who transmuted Ogre Mage belts recently though. But this will have been over 2 years since that was introduced, and there is always a risk in TD something new will be printed that will obsolete something we’ve already acquired.

Jeff321 wrote:

OrionW wrote: It is OK for there to be some tokens that are a more powerful than expected

Agreed. I am fine with the occasional overpowered completion token. I think this one is fine. I do feel for those who transmuted Ogre Mage belts recently though. But this will have been over 2 years since that was introduced, and there is always a risk in TD something new will be printed that will obsolete something we’ve already acquired.

Meh, I'm still 50/50 on if it really steps on Ogre Mage all that l much. For practical purposes, Ogre Mage provides the same bonus if you have odd STR and counts towards thrown/mighty weapons.

Plus, Ogre Mage comes right to my door from stuff I already have. If this is in-person convention only, that's travel + hotel + badge + time off I don't have to spend.

OrionW wrote:

jedibcg Banjo 5150 Lover wrote: No one is against people having nice things. It is arguably better than UR's and the very recent transmute. It sets a bad precedent to make a rare better than those. Why buy a UR if there is going to be a better rare? Not equal, better (arguably). It creates a terrible power curve. Now you cannot do a UR in the waist unless it is better than this and therefore way better than previous UR's.

If this was a rare you could get in a random token pack or in a token order I agree completely. I don't see the same issue with the limited supply of tokens given out as a completion token.

Other people in this thread have recommended that completion tokens and volunteer tokens get a different back and I like this idea. These tokens don't go through the normal player review process, they are less common than the classification would imply (UC, R, UR), and they tend to be more valuable. A change to show that they are special would be a good thing.

It’s not clear to me that a completion token is any scarcer than a pack rare.

A liberal estimate would, I think, put the total number of tokens sold in a year at less than 100 8k orders. That would get you 2,400 of any given rare total. At Gen con there are something like 2000 tickets sold per dungeon (not all will be hardcore+ though).

A completion token is, I speculate, are much less likely to get transmuted and much more likely to circulate based on how they are distributed.

TL:DR; I wouldn’t expect scarcity of there tokens. Lamp of the Marid and Lamp of the Efreeti belong in any BiS build, and it’s hard to sell them for more than $10 after several years.

Finally, like the +2 melee damage completion token boots - there is no reason to assume these won’t be printed as a standard pack rare in 2022.

jedibcg Banjo 5150 Lover wrote:

OrionW wrote:

jedibcg Banjo 5150 Lover wrote: No one is against people having nice things. It is arguably better than UR's and the very recent transmute. It sets a bad precedent to make a rare better than those. Why buy a UR if there is going to be a better rare? Not equal, better (arguably). It creates a terrible power curve. Now you cannot do a UR in the waist unless it is better than this and therefore way better than previous UR's.

If this was a rare you could get in a random token pack or in a token order I agree completely. I don't see the same issue with the limited supply of tokens given out as a completion token.

Other people in this thread have recommended that completion tokens and volunteer tokens get a different back and I like this idea. These tokens don't go through the normal player review process, they are less common than the classification would imply (UC, R, UR), and they tend to be more valuable. A change to show that they are special would be a good thing.

Except that it is still better than a UR. I have nothing against a new classification (assuming it would not affect trade goods). I have no issue with it being better than the rare. Better than the UR means the next waist UR has to be better than it, or else no one would want it.

This is a large downside (depending on ones perspective) I hadn’t considered.

We’ll need a new melee waist any year now and there is basically no room between this and relic girdle of frost giant strength. RIP girdle of frost giant strength...

I came up with 1 positive for this belt. It can burn through Hitchhiking Ghost: Shog to make them even rarer...hmmm maybe that isn't a positive....

Future melee URs that could be printed at the waist slot:

flat +4 Str
+4 to melee dmg
+3 str, +3 con
+3 str, +3 dex

Or maybe those are unrealistic and it really is Beltageddon rn.

Marc D wrote:

Jeff321 wrote:

OrionW wrote: It is OK for there to be some tokens that are a more powerful than expected

Agreed. I am fine with the occasional overpowered completion token. I think this one is fine. I do feel for those who transmuted Ogre Mage belts recently though. But this will have been over 2 years since that was introduced, and there is always a risk in TD something new will be printed that will obsolete something we’ve already acquired.

Meh, I'm still 50/50 on if it really steps on Ogre Mage all that l much. For practical purposes, Ogre Mage provides the same bonus if you have odd STR and counts towards thrown/mighty weapons.

Plus, Ogre Mage comes right to my door from stuff I already have. If this is in-person convention only, that's travel + hotel + badge + time off I don't have to spend.

The thing that bothers me the most is that ogre mage is still being transmuted and that it's a 4 star and doesn't technically stack (without big burn)....the ioun stone stacked....the upcoming charm stacks with banshee, etc....I may have though twice about the 8 total belts I've transmuted (for me and loaner builds), had I known it would be eclipsed by a rare completion. hindsight is 20/20. I had planned on sending 1 more in....and now I will not, so there is that. That, overall, is where I agree it sets a rough precedent. I LOVE all the solid rares coming out to help facilitate new players. I HOPE if this happens in IRL dungeons, somehow, that players are made aware of how good it is...I would hate to see a new player get rid of it willy nilly. I know I'd let my pugs know if I were in them.

Is completion token value variance the TD hill willing to die on? Probably not. I was upset about completion tokens in the past and the inanity of them just became an expected feature.

I actually would rank it above class transmute specs (hillwise) as I could see class transmutes becoming a CF pretty quick.

I wonder what the hill will look like.

Anyway, consider:
Bead of the Bear: Like uncommon ring.
Bead of the Dire Bear: Like rare ring.
Belt of the Brave: See other people's thoughts. Oh, one more thing, wasted opportunity to have Immunity to Fear.
Boots of the Bold: Seems kind of good, like 4-star level in the game, but unc v rare participation token (whatever that means) has been a distinction that maybe never should have existed.
Charm of the Earth: Very bold.
Charm of the Wind: Same effect as Banshee Prism.
Cowl of Warming: I could see this being comparable to a normal uncommon that nobody would bother with.
Hood of Reflection: Within the realm of narrow use specialty tokens at this rarity.
Ring of One Vision: Seems very Grindy along the lines of Pandemonium only way less cool.

Some of these things are not like the others. But, then, I have completion tokens I can't get rid of and there are others I'd still be fine getting more of. so kind of par for the course except not so obviously being equivalent to URs.