TOPIC: Artifact Issues

FYI: I think some additional attention needs to be paid regarding Artifacts (and how DM's are supposed to deal with them).

- I did a Golden Ticket run with Smakdown where we used his Charm of Comraderie, but I don't recall him taking any damage when our party members were hit. (Maybe he did it automatically and I didn't notice it).

- During a True Grind run I was running, Widseth had his Dancing Sword attack a flying harpy, saying that the Dancing Sword could fly. But the Token Guide specifically says that the Dancing Sword *cannot* fly.

- I talked with the owner of Caitlin's Charm, and he was also surprised about some of the wording in the Token Guide. He didn't realize that he got last pick of the two classes (he thought he could pick one normally, and then his second was one of the left over ones). There was also confusion whether the "armor" restriction would apply to items like the Monk's Belt (and possibly the Cloak of the Mage).

- Gertz's Radiant Backpack doesn't really explain how it is supposed to work. Apparently, at the beginning of the con, Gertz gives those items to Jeff and the Backpack works for the rest of the con (some sort of official note from Jeff that Gertz could carry around would help). There was also questions regarding whether the bonus of an item sacrificed to the Backpack could stack with wearing the item normally (i.e. is the bonus still coming from the item or is it "laundered" through the Backpack)? More specifically, could you get +3 AC from the Backpack which ate an Oakskin Medallion, and then still use another Oakskin Medallion in your neck slot for another +3 AC?

- How does the Golden Apple of Eris' penalty (which triggers when you roll a "1" on a saving throw) interact with the Questor's Charm of Luck (which allows a reroll of a "1")?

Incognito wrote: - How does the Golden Apple of Eris' penalty (which triggers when you roll a "1" on a saving throw) interact with the Questor's Charm of Luck (which allows a reroll of a "1")?

well, i just let my girlfriend use my questors charm, so we didnt have to deal with that issue.

Also, if you roll a "20" on the secondary roll, does it bring back characters who normally can't be resurrected? (i.e. some final rooms have characters get disintegrated or have their souls sucked away, and cannot be brought back normally - in these cases only the Savior Stone can save them). I'm guessing that the Golden Apple only helps with cases where you can bring people back with Death's Door or Elixir of Life? Does it work on people who died in prior rooms (and who normally can't be brought back in a later room)?

Yes, my mistake, I did not realize both cards had to be picked after everyone else's. I thou I was supposed to pick one, and select the second from what was remaining.
Luckily, this year was only full runs with people we knew so it was a non issue. Who else would want to play the monk anyways?

Could you help me trouble shoot the armor issue?

david wrote: Yes, my mistake, I did not realize both cards had to be picked after everyone else's. I thou I was supposed to pick one, and select the second from what was remaining.
Luckily, this year was only full runs with people we knew so it was a non issue. Who else would want to play the monk anyways?

Could you help me trouble shoot the armor issue?

Welcome to the forums David!

The PM system is down right now. But major thanks to you and Jill for the ride to the airport. That really helped out A LOT! I definitely appreciate it!

no problem, anytime.

That backpack was a pain and a half, but just for one group.

ME: Okay the Sea Lich hits the paladin.
PARTY: It takes three damage from the Amulet of Thorns we put in the backpack.
ME: Okay, the paladin has to make a saving throw...
PARTY: We also put a Medallion of Greyhawk into the backpack.
ME: You put a what in the what now?

bpsymington wrote: That backpack was a pain and a half, but just for one group.

ME: Okay the Sea Lich hits the paladin.
PARTY: It takes three damage from the Amulet of Thorns we put in the backpack.
ME: Okay, the paladin has to make a saving throw...
PARTY: We also put a Medallion of Greyhawk into the backpack.
ME: You put a what in the what now?

Did they seriously sacrifice permanently a Medallion of Greyhawk? They have to turn in any items in the backpack, right?

Yup.

bpsymington wrote: That backpack was a pain and a half, but just for one group.

ME: Okay the Sea Lich hits the paladin.
PARTY: It takes three damage from the Amulet of Thorns we put in the backpack.
ME: Okay, the paladin has to make a saving throw...
PARTY: We also put a Medallion of Greyhawk into the backpack.
ME: You put a what in the what now?

wow. thats awesome. i had started wondering how amazing that backpack can be if a group is willing to start saccing URs. hmm, will the whole group get +1 level if they sac 3 might items?

kurtreznor wrote:

bpsymington wrote: That backpack was a pain and a half, but just for one group.

ME: Okay the Sea Lich hits the paladin.
PARTY: It takes three damage from the Amulet of Thorns we put in the backpack.
ME: Okay, the paladin has to make a saving throw...
PARTY: We also put a Medallion of Greyhawk into the backpack.
ME: You put a what in the what now?

wow. thats awesome. i had started wondering how amazing that backpack can be if a group is willing to start saccing URs. hmm, will the whole group get +1 level if they sac 3 might items?

According to the Token Guide, you cannot put weapons or armor in the Backpack (Armor includes body armor, shields, and helms).

Orb and Scepter of Might would count as Weapons.

Girdle and Boots of Might seem feasible. Unknown whether the Crown of Might would be close enough to a Helm to count as "Armor."

david wrote: Yes, my mistake, I did not realize both cards had to be picked after everyone else's. I thou I was supposed to pick one, and select the second from what was remaining.
Luckily, this year was only full runs with people we knew so it was a non issue. Who else would want to play the monk anyways?

Could you help me trouble shoot the armor issue?

According to the guide:

The possessor of this Charm is allowed to play a multi-class character. He picks two classes from any of *THE* remaining character cards (after everyone has picked theirs) and he carries both cards with him during the adventure. The charcater can use any spells or special powers from either character and use any magic item (other than armor) usable by ?BOTH?. As a dual-class wizard he could wield a sword but not wear armor. The character's hit points are equal to the sum of both classes, and all armor restrictions still apply. Saving throws are compared from both classes and the highest is used.

I think the "both" Should probably read as "either".

TD (and the token guide) are a bit hazy regarding the classification of tokens.

Strictly speaking, the token guide lists three categories of Armor: body Armor, Shields, and Helms.

You could probably make a legitimate argument that the Monk's Belt, Cloak of the Arch Mage, and Robe of the Arch Mage, are not technically armor and should not be affected by the current description of Caitlin's Charm. It might be a bit unbalanced however, to have a Monk/Wizard using all 3 for +11 AC.

But as with the other artifacts, the ultimate arbitrator is Jeff, so he's going to be able to change the rules one way or the other, in the end.