TOPIC: Semi-Lich Skull

Anthony Barnstable wrote:

Druegar wrote: as a reminder

Druegar wrote:
The completed "Cavadar's Grill" (not the final name!) token's power has not been decided.

I get that. That is part of why Semi-Lich Skull as a 2020 token is a very odd choice. There’s a chance it is useless to anyone who makes the transmute, in my mind there’s a chance it is an ingredient but that seems pretty low, there’s a chance it will combo with that token, but its function is highly dependent on a 2021 token that drastically changes its usability as BiS or intended for resale to players who can’t make the transmute and that is a weird position for a token to be in. I’m not sure that has actually ever happened to another token?

It’s actually a pretty solid token for someone coming in at the end of the teeth cycle, teeth 5 , 6, and 7 were / are / will be fairly cheap, so the skull is free hp and psychic enablement. I would be more worried about it if teeth 1,2, and 3 weren’t so expensive

Yeah I think the Skull is targeted at players who can't/didn't collect all the teeth. So in that case my hope is that it doesn't stack and you have to choose between the individual teeth and the completed Dentures of Cavadar, not both. So the Dentures would need to have stats equal or better than +7 HP. That way everyone who does have a full set of Teeth isn't disincentivized from transmuting to the Dentures.

Regardless, the Skull is still in print next year so I am skipping it for now and waiting to next year to decide if I want one (I am hoping I won't).

I posted about these issues during development too: truedungeon.com/forum?view=topic&catid=615&id=250035&start=24#347591

Maybe we’re looking at this wrong. Not every token is meant for every player.

If this is meant as a “consolation” token for players who get a few teeth but aren’t willing to drop $2k on the old ones to get a full grill, then it’s good. We need something like that to fill the gap between 0 and 7 Teeth.

For those of us waiting to get the full set next year, the Skull just isn’t meant for us. And if it is an ingredient it’ll still be a PYP next year.

I just Hope next year we get a “dragons nest” somethingorother that does something for unused dragon orbs.

I know you can turn in 5 for one transmute, but I think it has to be 5 different ones - so I think there are going to be leftovers.

Brad Mortensen wrote: Maybe we’re looking at this wrong. Not every token is meant for every player.

If this is meant as a “consolation” token for players who get a few teeth but aren’t willing to drop $2k on the old ones to get a full grill, then it’s good. We need something like that to fill the gap between 0 and 7 Teeth.

For those of us waiting to get the full set next year, the Skull just isn’t meant for us. And if it is an ingredient it’ll still be a PYP next year.

Well, the Skull may or may not be for people with a Transmuted Tooth token, it hasn't been announced yet. I'm OK either way. I'll be waiting to order any until I know if it works with the Transmuted Token, since that's what my party will have.

Jeff321 wrote: Regardless, the Skull is still in print next year so I am skipping it for now and waiting to next year to decide if I want one (I am hoping I won't).

+1

I got serious about collecting tokens a couple of years ago, so I had to go back and acquire Teeth 1-3. (Fortunately, they cost less then than they do now.) I expect to have all 7 Teeth in 2021 and to make Cavadar’s Grill (or whatever) when it is available. Having a Skull in 2020 would be nice for the extra HP. If I happen to get one as a random UR, great. But since we don’t know if it will work with the completed item, and the completed item might imbue Psychic Power on its own, I’m not going to include a Skull in my 2020 PYPs. Given what we know now, the Skull seems to have more value for people who expect to have some, but not all, Teeth. (This could all change, of course!)

ralykam wrote:

Picc wrote: I seem to recall a comment by Jeff during design that the completed teeth would very probably grant psychic powers on their own but would not count towards the bonus HPs granted by skull after being transmuted. The implication seemed to be that you would need second set of non transmuted teeth if you wished to get HPs from the skull in addition to the benefit of the completed Cavadar item.

Take it with a grain of salt though, I have mis-rememberd and mis-interpenetrated things many times.

I'm guessing you're thinking of this :

Jeff Martin wrote: They will NOT count since they will all be turned in to make the big 7-year item. Folks will have to decide what they wanna do.

I wasn't sure if that changed in later conversations though.

This is what I remember as well. Transmute will most likely grant psychic power but will not bestow extra hp if you have a Lich Skull.

Rob F wrote:

ralykam wrote:

Picc wrote: I seem to recall a comment by Jeff during design that the completed teeth would very probably grant psychic powers on their own but would not count towards the bonus HPs granted by skull after being transmuted. The implication seemed to be that you would need second set of non transmuted teeth if you wished to get HPs from the skull in addition to the benefit of the completed Cavadar item.

Take it with a grain of salt though, I have mis-rememberd and mis-interpenetrated things many times.

I'm guessing you're thinking of this :

Jeff Martin wrote: They will NOT count since they will all be turned in to make the big 7-year item. Folks will have to decide what they wanna do.

I wasn't sure if that changed in later conversations though.

This is what I remember as well. Transmute will most likely grant psychic power but will not bestow extra hp if you have a Lich Skull.

I already have ways to have a stupidly large amount of hit points. I’m fine with no extra hp.

Anthony Barnstable wrote:

Druegar wrote: as a reminder

Druegar wrote:
The completed "Cavadar's Grill" (not the final name!) token's power has not been decided.

I get that. That is part of why Semi-Lich Skull as a 2020 token is a very odd choice. There’s a chance it is useless to anyone who makes the transmute, in my mind there’s a chance it is an ingredient but that seems pretty low, there’s a chance it will combo with that token, but its function is highly dependent on a 2021 token that drastically changes its usability as BiS or intended for resale to players who can’t make the transmute and that is a weird position for a token to be in. I’m not sure that has actually ever happened to another token?

The 2020 design process was odd all around, I agree with you on the Skull.

If anything, it's still a great token to free up an Ioun Slot as you can ditch the Amethyst Ovoid until and if the combined Teeth Grant Psychic ability. If that does not happen it's still great item to have a slotless item grant the power and would not render it totally useless.

I remember Jeff saying you cannot use both Combined Teeth and singles for the Skull but it seems anything is still possible.

JACKOFTRADZE wrote:

Anthony Barnstable wrote:

Druegar wrote: as a reminder

Druegar wrote:
The completed "Cavadar's Grill" (not the final name!) token's power has not been decided.

I get that. That is part of why Semi-Lich Skull as a 2020 token is a very odd choice. There’s a chance it is useless to anyone who makes the transmute, in my mind there’s a chance it is an ingredient but that seems pretty low, there’s a chance it will combo with that token, but its function is highly dependent on a 2021 token that drastically changes its usability as BiS or intended for resale to players who can’t make the transmute and that is a weird position for a token to be in. I’m not sure that has actually ever happened to another token?

The 2020 design process was odd all around, I agree with you on the Skull.

If anything, it's still a great token to free up an Ioun Slot as you can ditch the Amethyst Ovoid until and if the combined Teeth Grant Psychic ability. If that does not happen it's still great item to have a slotless item grant the power and would not render it totally useless.

I remember Jeff saying you cannot use both Combined Teeth and singles for the Skull but it seems anything is still possible.

Good point on the psychic. For new players coming in or those that don't have Ovoid or the Shirt slotless psychic is really good.

Anthony Barnstable wrote: in my mind there’s a chance it is an ingredient but that seems pretty low

Really? I'm at the other end of the spectrum. In my mind, I've always suspected that there is likely to be a recipe that takes any one of the UR tokens that activate pshychic ability (maybe with no trade goods). And likely a second recipe that takes a Rare token that provides pshychic ability as well as more trade goods.

Fiddy wrote:

Anthony Barnstable wrote: in my mind there’s a chance it is an ingredient but that seems pretty low

Really? I'm at the other end of the spectrum. In my mind, I've always suspected that there is likely to be a recipe that takes any one of the UR tokens that activate pshychic ability (maybe with no trade goods). And likely a second recipe that takes a Rare token that provides pshychic ability as well as more trade goods.

It’s certaibly possible, but thats not how ROSP was done.

I think requiring seven 1k reward tokens plus one of each trade good is plenty.