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TOPIC: Tokens for 1st time players

Tokens for 1st time players 7 months 2 weeks ago #13

If you're running with a bunch of new players, I would recommend just making sure everyone has a weapon and not worry about extra tokens unless it's *really* critical. Normal is easily doable with starter packs.

Focus on keeping the action going in combat rooms and try to keep the mood light hearted. Adding a bunch of tokens just raises the seriousness level too fast for new players.

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Tokens for 1st time players 7 months 2 weeks ago #14

The only token I can *remember* being lent to me was Linked Shirt of Healing. That worked well. My friend who tends to play cleric got a couple things to increase healing besides Linked Shirt of Healing on that same run. That did not destroy the experience.

I've been wanting to unload tokens on people to reduce the amount I own as well as am happy to lend stuff out to play at a higher difficulty level, but I find that it's just such a varied experience with PUGs that I'm now highly unmotivated to offer to provide anything, even if it benefits me (lend out Charms of Good Fortune to hit a higher threshold).

If someone wants to borrow something or is looking for something (I stupidly didn't unload a Defender piece on someone who needed the third piece), I'm happy to give away, sell, and/or lend things up to a certain point. But, I'm sensitive to how a lot of people only want help when they ask for it, and it's obvious in people's expressions and body language that players who push in any way can rub other players the wrong way.

I'd say the most useful tokens to give away or lend are HP increasers and rare weapons (especially ranged). Whether someone appreciates or resents such or anything else just seems a crapshoot.

Actually, if a true first time player, probably should just be playing with a starter pack (plus borrowing or whatever from the rest of the actual starter packs) to experience TD the same way lots of us experienced it the first time. Beyond first time players, the experience levels and token use interests in PUGs playing on normal can be all over the place.

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Tokens for 1st time players 7 months 2 weeks ago #15

As a coach, I will say loaning out tokens for first time players usually isn't an issue, as long as its done early in the process. If I come to a group with some first timers and the group is in flux, with some vets coming in and token trades happening, I have a trick. I tick mark stats, but don't hard code them. So if some one offers boosts with loner armor or Ioun Stones, its a simple add a few tick marks and go. Just let the coach know. Anything hard coded is best, as conditionals are murky.
But be sure to let first timers have their fun. Let them use their weapons and spells and enjoy the ride. Don't over whelm with high level conditions. They will get addicted and be back for more runs, no doubt.
We have met the enemy and they are ours:Two ships, two brigs, one schooner and one sloop
September 10, 1813

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Tokens for 1st time players 7 months 2 weeks ago #16

Matthew Hayward wrote: Someone (Brad maybe?) posted an idea on this a long time ago, which was to bring 10x of one usable by all token that is in a slot unlikely to be filled by new players (Ioun, Charm, Earcuff) and leave it at that.

"Hey - I've got Ioun Stone Ruby Rhombus for everyone, so we can all take -3 damage from fire."


Perfect

That was super-successful on Giant’s Travail. Some newbies and experienced players were on that run, and everyone had or made room for an Ioun Stone Topaz Sphere.

When that wight-thing at the end started hitting people for 10 Darkrift every round, one guy said “we have these Spheres...” before I could remind anyone. So we proceeded to beat her senseless, immune to her counter-attacks.

It made a big difference, and it was just one thing so that at least one person remembered without me chiming in. And the DM said we were one of the first groups he’d seen defeat the room, let alone with zero casualties.

They were so excited and thanked me afterwards. From my experience, that’s the way to go. Keep it simple.

I forgot that lesson a couple of times after that, and was reminded why I stopped trying to help too much.

Anymore, I only lend CoAs or CoGFs and sometimes level 5 stuff. Maybe a key token (like Topaz) if I can identify one. This year, I think that may be Ruby as Matthew mentioned.

The only time I lend out full builds is on sponsored newbie runs, when I can email copies to people ahead of time, with explanations on everything. It seems too overwhelming to drop that on people in the coaching room.
barkley.neo.rr.com -->see my trade thread HERE , my eBay store HERE or my web store HERE
"Ceci n'est pas une pipe" - Magritte

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Last edit: by Brad Mortensen.

Tokens for 1st time players 7 months 2 weeks ago #17

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Brad Mortensen wrote: The only time I lend out full builds is on sponsored newbie runs, when I can email copies to people ahead of time, with explanations on everything. It seems too overwhelming to drop that on people in the coaching room.

When I have new people (or even my existing players) play at Gen Con using our tokens I print name tags that have key token abilities on it. DR: -3 Fire, -2 Cold, -1 Melee. Cast 2x spells 1 rnd 1/room. That kind of thing. I tell everyone if you can remember this stuff it is good, if you cannot don't worry about it. It is similar to the skill tests for spells. Better to not know fast that take awhile and remember.
drive.google.com/file/d/1RpQm3vHoB4z3j60c6L2PxbEj_msLwUIr/view?usp=sharing
Those are from last year. I haven't updated them yet for 2019.
Not recommending doing this for your pugs just something I thought of when Brad mentioned equipping new folks with tokens. Even my players that have been playing since 2010 don't know well tokens so it is a refresher each year.
You either discover a star or you don't. You arrogant punk.

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Tokens for 1st time players 7 months 2 weeks ago #18

@JediBC - absolutely. That’s included in the emails I send out ahead of time. I ask them to print out their character, but bring along spares for people who forget.

They seem to like holding a photocopy of their tokens. They’re much easier to pass around than piles of tokens, they can reference them in the dungeon (our new “notes” rule legalized it), and I don’t care if I get them back or not - unlike the tokens themselves. I care about those a lot more. So I only have to worry about collecting the rare weapons after the final combat.
barkley.neo.rr.com -->see my trade thread HERE , my eBay store HERE or my web store HERE
"Ceci n'est pas une pipe" - Magritte

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Last edit: by Brad Mortensen.

Tokens for 1st time players 7 months 2 weeks ago #19

For my group, which has always included a few people who have never played, I usually print out the tdcharactercreator.com/ sheet for each build and hand them out with the folders containing the tokens. I believe its page 2 or 3 has the conditional effects on it, I then write out the token that gave that effect.

For a random pug, I share/give/sell whatever commons and uncommons that I pulled, but I do not bring extra for them.
“You will hear it for yourself, and it will surely fill you with wonder.”
Marco Polo

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Tokens for 1st time players 7 months 2 weeks ago #20

Everyone needs to
Have a red weapon and
At least a Green for Ranged.
I have played with kids before,
And when the judge says
Ranged weapons only,
I hate hearing “well I don’t have anything”
Otherwise if you got them,
Give everyone a COS,
Up to +10 HP for everyone really helps.
I really against level boosters
For 1st timers,
Let them rock the 4th level card
And learn the game that way 1st.
When a Falcon's Strike breaks the body
of its prey, it is because of timing.
Sun Tzu
Art of War 500 B.C.

D&D, been playing 35 years
GenCon, been going 23 years Straight
True Dungeon, been playing 16 years Straight and all 4 events last year.

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Tokens for 1st time players 7 months 2 weeks ago #21

The Falcon wrote: Everyone needs to
Have a red weapon and
At least a Green for Ranged.
I have played with kids before,
And when the judge says
Ranged weapons only,
I hate hearing “well I don’t have anything”
Otherwise if you got them,
Give everyone a COS,
Up to +10 HP for everyone really helps.
I really against level boosters
For 1st timers,
Let them rock the 4th level card
And learn the game that way 1st.


I agree in general. Making a newbie into a L5 Wizard would be bad.

I helped a newbie Fighter to L5 last year because everyone else except one had played before, over half were already L5, and I didn’t think it would be too confusing. And I talked some of the other vets out of pushing for Hardcore, even though I wanted the XP. Seemed like too much stress for our young padawans.

Never did it on an all-Newbie run. Never would.
barkley.neo.rr.com -->see my trade thread HERE , my eBay store HERE or my web store HERE
"Ceci n'est pas une pipe" - Magritte

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Tokens for 1st time players 7 months 2 weeks ago #22

Brad Mortensen wrote:

The Falcon wrote: Everyone needs to
Have a red weapon and
At least a Green for Ranged.
I have played with kids before,
And when the judge says
Ranged weapons only,
I hate hearing “well I don’t have anything”
Otherwise if you got them,
Give everyone a COS,
Up to +10 HP for everyone really helps.
I really against level boosters
For 1st timers,
Let them rock the 4th level card
And learn the game that way 1st.


I agree in general. Making a newbie into a L5 Wizard would be bad.

I helped a newbie Fighter to L5 last year because everyone else except one had played before, over half were already L5, and I didn’t think it would be too confusing. And I talked some of the other vets out of pushing for Hardcore, even though I wanted the XP. Seemed like too much stress for our young padawans.

Never did it on an all-Newbie run. Never would.


I really don’t think the higher level card is that much harder. I just feel bonus level and awakened synergy are straight forward and easy. They are the main tokens I lone. I loan out some TEs but nothing crazy on that front either.
The bonus level increases the hit points a few other stats they will never notice and gives some cool extras, but it’s all pretty straight forward.

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Tokens for 1st time players 7 months 2 weeks ago #23

Braxton Thomason wrote: If you're running with a bunch of new players, I would recommend just making sure everyone has a weapon and not worry about extra tokens unless it's *really* critical. Normal is easily doable with starter packs.

Focus on keeping the action going in combat rooms and try to keep the mood light hearted. Adding a bunch of tokens just raises the seriousness level too fast for new players.


As a coach and someone who plays a lot of pugs when i'm not coaching there's definitely a range of folks. You come across who are really thankful for the loaned gear and others who don't want to be handed tokens or it's too much information too quickly.

For new players in a pug i keep enough rare weapons/armor to gear any given glass. The +1 rare classless weapons are great and inexpensive for this. Then it's a few of the more flexible bits of armor. Helps a lot without being overwhelming or too 'pushy' and i bring that stuff out when a new player didn't pull anything. We've all seen bad packs or just nothing usable. I keep a spare defender/footman set on hand for this along with the classless weapons.

I tend to load out full builds under these situations:
A newer (but not brand new) and wants to play a class i'm geared for in a situation where they have tokens and do want to try a harder difficulty and it ends up being easier to offer spare build vs trying to move tokens around.

Wait listed/late walk in player and with coach blessing i'll offer the late player a spare/loaner build i keep on hand if it can save some time where collectively the training time matters more and really aside from stats on party card i'm just loaning a stat line and weapons to simplify things.

I'm in a group with some vets and someone wants to try a different class but doesn't have a build and it gives me an excuse to play one of my alts.
We're all the kind of people who enjoy the game on a "meta" level. We like talking about the game year-round. We buy tokens. We enjoy crafting. We get together during the off-season if we can. We are a very skewed demographic that way. -Raven

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Tokens for 1st time players 7 months 6 days ago #24

I've done this a few times, and I haven't got my system quite down yet.

1) show up as early as possible <-I need to learn to do that, I've tried to come in after coaches are already logging tokens

2) be organized <- I'm working on that too :whistle: :laugh:

I'm bringing enough Defender sets to go around to 3-4 players, Linked Shirts of Healing, and weapons (the most success I've had was loaning Monk weapons to 2 women at PAX this year - they made good use of my bracers & 5 shuriken). Then, if there's time, I have a few death-related items, +1 token enhancers, and some Ioun stones. Anything more than that will probably be too much to be worth the effort.

3) Listen

So far people in my groups have been receptive & thankful for the assist, but no need to be pushy.
I came here to sing and collect tokens, and I'm alllll out of money.

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