TOPIC: 2019 polymorph item errata (it's a good thing)

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Arnold wrote:

kurtreznor wrote: Oi, something that seems to be forgotten: the details of the new druid item did specify that you had to choose ONE elemental form per room. So, no switching between fire and water. But the items didnt specify that you could only polymorph 1/room, so that is still a valid question.

Whatever is decided, i just ask that the relic not get nerfed for the sole purpose of making the legendary a bigger upgrade. If the relic is good how it is but the legendary is barely better, then give the legendary a small boost...most of the effect text isnt on the token anyway.

Edit: for the record, i dont consider casting while polymorph to be that great, usually if you are casting in a room you arent polymorphed. It is mostly useful in grind where combat takes longer and you might need to stop attacking for a round to cast a heal

I could understand this stance, but then there isn't really much point for anyone to upgrade to legendary.

1. +1.5 avg damage on the wheel
2. +resistance when casting
3. keep potions.

That's underwhelming for 40k gold and tons of Trade Goods. #3 is the only one that feels really neat.

I'd assumed since spell-casting was specifically spelled out on the Legendary, that it should be unique to the legendary. Instantaneous back and forth kind of detracts from that, IMO.

Legendaries are almost never a good “value.” They are for people who want the absolute best equipment.

Legendary AC items gave +2 ac (or even +1!), Legendary weapons often give +2 to hit and damage.

Viewed in this context +1.5 damage, 5 dr from the elemental type of your choice, and the ability to not expend consumables makes this a quite large relic to legendary bump.

Consider it this way: this lets you use Potion Polymorph Brownie for free - giving you +1 to save and +3 to ac - much better than any relic to legendary ac bump.

I'll take your word for it because I've never analyzed other Relic > Legendary trends.

But as far as your Brownie example - I would never give up 7.5 points on the damage wheel for the defensive buffs on the Brownie potion.

Other than puzzles, I think the Gremlin Potion probably gets the biggest boost. Druids can now try to go Holy Avenger on some constructs.

It would seem to correct several issues if the polymorph ability of the new item is limited to once per room. Since already you can only polymorph into one elemental form per room, having just one change per room makes sense. The same is true for the potions. You only get to use it once.

Otherwise the Shirt of the Fae is meaningless, as you can poly back to human to cast one round, and back into an elemental the next. It is less of an issue with the Ultra Rare, as it costs a spell every time, but the Relic has no penalty. The Legendary ability to allow spell casting makes more sense this way also.

Cranston wrote: It would seem to correct several issues if the polymorph ability of the new item is limited to once per room. Since already you can only polymorph into one elemental form per room, having just one change per room makes sense. The same is true for the potions. You only get to use it once.

Otherwise the Shirt of the Fae is meaningless, as you can poly back to human to cast one round, and back into an elemental the next. It is less of an issue with the Ultra Rare, as it costs a spell every time, but the Relic has no penalty. The Legendary ability to allow spell casting makes more sense this way also.

Shirt of the Fae would still be meaningful for anyone without the Relic or Legendary Shaman tokens. Even with the UR Shaman token you can't do too much polymorphing back and forth without running out of first level spells.

Jeff and co. are enjoying some well-earned R&R this week, so I won't be discussing this topic with him until next week. (Yes, It will be discussed.)

Until then, let's all take a deep breath... release... and relax.

Per Jeff, one may not polymorph into more than one creature per round.
ETA: strike-through, see my next post in this thread

Druegar wrote: Per Jeff, one may not polymorph into more than one creature per round.

Does "Creature" include human?

Could one start the round as a "creature," return to human form, take a standard action, then return to "creature" form?

Or does changing back to human count?

Druegar wrote: Per Jeff, one may not polymorph into more than one creature per round.

Changing back does not count, I'm guessing.

Round 1 - Change into Elemental
Round 2 - Change back, take action, change into Elemental
Round 3 - Change back, use Pouch of Tulz to change into a Viper, take action
Round 4 - Change back, use main action to drink potion and change into Cave Bear

Would all of this be okay?

Human is a change I am guessing, otherwise you can cast a spell with the relic which seems lame for the legendary. I do not speak for TPTB.

Can they skip the human transformation?

Round 1 air elemental, realize there is an immunity they didn’t realize
Round 2 fire elemental directly from air elemental, another unexpected immunity
Round 3+ viper, no more immunities! Keep that form.

Or is that limited to a level of item such as relic or legendary?

macXdmg wrote: Human is a change I am guessing, otherwise you can cast a spell with the relic which seems lame for the legendary. I do not speak for TPTB.

Can they skip the human transformation?

Round 1 air elemental, realize there is an immunity they didn’t realize
Round 2 fire elemental directly from air elemental, another unexpected immunity
Round 3+ viper, no more immunities! Keep that form.

Or is that limited to a level of item such as relic or legendary?

I'm on my phone so I can't find the reference, but the original token text that Jeff proposed said you could only change into one elemental type per room.

I agree about the relic implications with spell casting but am awaiting to see what is ruled.

Arnold wrote: I'm on my phone so I can't find the reference, but the original token text that Jeff proposed said you could only change into one elemental type per room.

It's here and you're correct.

I had another chat with Jeff and he made the following ruling:
Whether using one of this year's polymorph items or not, no character may polymorph into more than one creature type per room.

Note: Assuming you have something which allows you to do so, you may transform into and out of the same creature type more than once per room.

Druegar wrote:

Arnold wrote: I'm on my phone so I can't find the reference, but the original token text that Jeff proposed said you could only change into one elemental type per room.

It's here and you're correct.

I had another chat with Jeff and he made the following ruling:
Whether using one of this year's polymorph items or not, no character may polymorph into more than one creature type per room.

Note: Assuming you have something which allows you to do so, you may transform into and out of the same creature type more than once per room.

Thanks!

Druegar wrote:

Arnold wrote: I'm on my phone so I can't find the reference, but the original token text that Jeff proposed said you could only change into one elemental type per room.

It's here and you're correct.

I had another chat with Jeff and he made the following ruling:
Whether using one of this year's polymorph items or not, no character may polymorph into more than one creature type per room.

Note: Assuming you have something which allows you to do so, you may transform into and out of the same creature type more than once per room.

So if I polymorph into a Brownie, I become immune to polymorph other effects from enemies