TOPIC: Build characters for Saving or for To Hit bonuses?

Incognito wrote:

henwy wrote: If I'm making a combat build my priority is usually like this:

Saves > +dam > +hit > hitpoints > AC

This is how it is for nightmare. The fact is that you almost always have HP and various protections in nightmare builds that the only thing which could possible take you out in one shot is save or die. I also slide pretty well so I'm at least fairly confident that I can land in the 17+ zone at least most of the time. Since building +dam usually results in some +hit no matter what due ot strength, that's usually good enough to land even on nightmare.

Bear in mind that low AC means you could die if you get hit multiple times in a row.

Like in grind when you hit me 6 times in a row? Thankfully StoneSkin + Viper shirt made all the hits 3hp instead of 12!

Until they come up with a UR token with 'Your DM is a dick' protection, those are just the ill winds of fortune one has to deal with. Odds are though with 10 targets to choose from and possible a cloak of shadowskin, AC isn't as important. Most combats don't last more than 4 rounds anyway so even if the monster gets 2 attacks...that's less than 1 attack per person on average. Your shadowskin should soak the first and even if you get unlucky, 1 hit almost never kills if you're topped off on HP.

On that note, is Cloak of Shadowskin perhaps the most overpowered token ever made? I mean in the unlikely event that I get hit by a monster's attack, there is a great chance it will be absorbed by the cloak.

FiannaTiger wrote: Like in grind when you hit me 6 times in a row? Thankfully StoneSkin + Viper shirt made all the hits 3hp instead of 12!

Were you referring to the Marileth at this year's WYC?

henwy wrote: Until they come up with a UR token with 'Your DM is a dick' protection, those are just the ill winds of fortune one has to deal with. Odds are though with 10 targets to choose from and possible a cloak of shadowskin, AC isn't as important. Most combats don't last more than 4 rounds anyway so even if the monster gets 2 attacks...that's less than 1 attack per person on average. Your shadowskin should soak the first and even if you get unlucky, 1 hit almost never kills if you're topped off on HP.

Kirk Bauer wrote: On that note, is Cloak of Shadowskin perhaps the most overpowered token ever made? I mean in the unlikely event that I get hit by a monster's attack, there is a great chance it will be absorbed by the cloak.

On higher difficulty levels, the existence of the Cloak of Shadowskin and the Lenses of Divine Sight has forced me to drastically change the attack behavior of monsters in order to maintain the same relative difficulty level.

On higher difficulty levels, it is often not worth spreading out monster attacks (especially when everyone is wearing the Shadowskin Cloak). Thus attacks are more likely to concentrate on a given player at a time.

mec2973 wrote: Even though we told our friend never again, he is wanting to try again with different builds. And the more I think about it, I don't think we did too bad for a first try on hardcore. At least everyone lived to the last room and got a chance to try and defeat the monster.

I think you did fine for a first try on Hardcore!

When you make that leap from Normal mode to Hardcore, you have to do some thinking... in fact, exactly the sort of thinking which you're doing right here. Unless you have URs & Relics all over the place, you need to make choices about your builds, and make sure you've got a well-rounded party.

Davoruk's post was excellent, and touches on a lot of the planning which goes into making a Hardcore run successful.

I'll add that sometimes, you get into a situation where one of your party *just* *can't* *hit* a monster, and the temptation is for them to feel frustrated or useless. But there's still a lot of things which you can do:

* You can use your slide to bump other party members into a good AC
* You can quaff a potion of Bull's Strength (or something similar)
* You can review your Class Powers! Sometimes you're forgetting a useful ability.
* You can use an auto-hit token (Triton Horn, Horn of Blasting, etc)
* You can Heal up.
* You can taunt the NPC monster, and perhaps direct their attacks to you.
* You can search the room - Is that Fountain there just for decoration, or does it have a purpose in this fight? Is that rune on the wall important?

It's often good planning to have some of your party with good +To Hit, others with good +Damage, and others with really high Saves, so you've always got someone who can survive, and then heal up the rest of the party later.

Incognito wrote:

FiannaTiger wrote: Like in grind when you hit me 6 times in a row? Thankfully StoneSkin + Viper shirt made all the hits 3hp instead of 12!

Were you referring to the Marileth at this year's WYC?

I liked the Marilith! It is one of the few monsters that has even bothered attacking me with physical attacks the past 3 years.

I have done greedy sealed runs the last three years and had a blast. I get to play a class I normally don't choose when well equipped, and I have to make some tough decisions. When you realize that you are only going to hit that room 7 boss on a crit, slide last and bump the other players into higher numbers.

We choose normal difficulty, share our starter packs and then add our treasure pulls and second starter pack for the second part of the storyline.

balthasar wrote: I have done greedy sealed runs the last three years and had a blast. I get to play a class I normally don't choose when well equipped, and I have to make some tough decisions. When you realize that you are only going to hit that room 7 boss on a crit, slide last and bump the other players into higher numbers.

We choose normal difficulty, share our starter packs and then add our treasure pulls and second starter pack for the second part of the storyline.

This does seem like fun. I did really enjoy the Green with Envy run this year. I may have to track down a greedy sealed set next year. Just let someone else organize *4 runs is too many to organize and fill*

Thank you everyone for the advice! There are a lot of great suggestions here.

I think while I am thinking about it, I will pull all my tokens back out and see what I can build.

I think I will try for a go to hit number and whatever saving I can add to that for my Ranger nbuild that my husband uses.

And then figure out max healing for my cleric build, since clerics can't use pointy weapons.

For Rangers, their saves are so high that it's (to me) worth it to slap a Wicked Charm on them for the +1 to-hit/Damage.

I literally never get attacked on my rogue. I feel like DMs look at my AC chuckle inside and decide to attack someone else lol.

Raven wrote: * You can taunt the NPC monster, and perhaps direct their attacks to you.

I'm still laughing at this .. you got them to do it twice .. during a PUZZLE run