TOPIC: GC Exclusivity only through 2015?

I understand it was inconsistent, but you can find the details of that discussion on another thread.

Throughout the entire con you could turn in your ticket and NOT do a run for a number of packs (and not ghost a character). Sunday (and maybe another time) some people were able to turn in ticket(s) get packs and still ghost.

marimacc wrote: And as I said, Gen Con does not charge True Dungeon for that event space, but Gen Con does have to pay for it, and of course the other misc. expenses like the actual cost of the tickets and credit card fees.

I have seen this posted many times on many different places on the 'Net. Due to the special 16-page contract that True Dungeon has with Gen Con, LLC I cannot comment on specific details of the special relationship and contract. If someone has obtained a copy of this contract, please post it to all to see.

Otherwise, please re-consider stating contract details as fact unless proof is presented. It would be much appreciated.

jedibcg wrote:

George wrote: Plus $48.00 for every ticket that is not turned in to True dungeon.

I bet there are at least 200 of those tickets.

I doubt there are that many. Remember they fill in from the waitlist to cover some of those. Plus this year if you just turned in your ticket to TD they gave you a number of packs. So though I don't know the number 200 tickets out of 790 runs seems way to high in my opinion.

I was not aware of this, so I checked with Lori tonight. She said that she did give out tokens on a handful of times (out of over 8,000 tickets) to people who missed their event start time AND it was too late for them to get refunds for the tickets. She said it was a tough call to make, but she felt it was the best thing to do customer-service-wise so the attendees did not walk away empty-handed without even a refund.

Jeff

Just so you know this was done by some of those working Check-in when Lori wasn't around. I of course have no idea how often. But I did see it happen at least twice. I am talking about someone turning in a ticket not doing a run and getting tokens (not the double dibbing). I cannot say that it was before or after their run had started (though I thought in one instance I heard the person say they would not be able to do their run, but maybe I didn't). I know the double dibbing happened on Sunday. It happened with me and I think Raven mentioned it happened to her too. I tried to explain that I shouldn't get tokens because I was 'ghosting' the event but the volunteer working assured me that this was a change and I was supposed to get the tokens and the wristbands. I can tell you the time and the run in PM if you want to look up the volunteer show they can be better coached next year if you like.

Jeff Martin wrote:

marimacc wrote: And as I said, Gen Con does not charge True Dungeon for that event space, but Gen Con does have to pay for it, and of course the other misc. expenses like the actual cost of the tickets and credit card fees.

I have seen this posted many times on many different places on the 'Net. Due to the special 16-page contract that True Dungeon has with Gen Con, LLC I cannot comment on specific details of the special relationship and contract. If someone has obtained a copy of this contract, please post it to all to see.

Otherwise, please re-consider stating contract details as fact unless proof is presented. It would be much appreciated.

Hi Jeff,


Oddly, my other account suddenly no longer works on the forums, or at least, no longer, very weirdly, will load the 3rd page of this thread. The Internet is quirky like that. I only mention it because I’m worried other users might be having problems. But no worries, I just made a new account, since the other one no longer works, to fix that so I could reply to your post.

Anyhow, of course, the details of whatever contract you may or may not have with Gen Con are between you and Gen Con alone. As I said, that’s none of my business.

HOWEVER, we get this question all the time on the Gen Con forums. People always assume you have to pay for your own event space, and if that were the case, it certainly would seem unfair to you, as Gen Con doesn’t charge other events for their space.

To that end, I did mention this in a forum report to Gen Con many months ago, and they assured me that, as far as the percentage of ticket sales, earning badges, and being provided free event space, that True Dungeon was treated no differently from any other event. That is, specifically, that TD receives free event space, just as any other event, which is completely fair. Derek Guder said I was authorized to post this, and that these facts, that TD was treated as any other event in these specific regards, were not confidential. He stated, and Jeannette agreed, that I was free to post that information on the Gen Con forums, and anywhere else If you feel they were both was incorrect in telling me that, I’m sure you can address it with them.

The important thing to me is that I don’t want anyone to think that Gen Con is somehow taking some unfair advantage of TD and making them pay for event space when other events aren’t. I wouldn’t want anyone to have the misperception that Gen Con was in any way treating TD unfairly, as I’m sure you wouldn’t either. Thanks for letting me clarify this!

Marian

Marian wrote:

Jeff Martin wrote:

marimacc wrote: And as I said, Gen Con does not charge True Dungeon for that event space, but Gen Con does have to pay for it, and of course the other misc. expenses like the actual cost of the tickets and credit card fees.

I have seen this posted many times on many different places on the 'Net. Due to the special 16-page contract that True Dungeon has with Gen Con, LLC I cannot comment on specific details of the special relationship and contract. If someone has obtained a copy of this contract, please post it to all to see.

Otherwise, please re-consider stating contract details as fact unless proof is presented. It would be much appreciated.

Hi Jeff,


Oddly, my other account suddenly no longer works on the forums, or at least, no longer, very weirdly, will load the 3rd page of this thread. The Internet is quirky like that. I only mention it because I’m worried other users might be having problems. But no worries, I just made a new account, since the other one no longer works, to fix that so I could reply to your post.

Anyhow, of course, the details of whatever contract you may or may not have with Gen Con are between you and Gen Con alone. As I said, that’s none of my business.

HOWEVER, we get this question all the time on the Gen Con forums. People always assume you have to pay for your own event space, and if that were the case, it certainly would seem unfair to you, as Gen Con doesn’t charge other events for their space.

To that end, I did mention this in a forum report to Gen Con many months ago, and they assured me that, as far as the percentage of ticket sales, earning badges, and being provided free event space, that True Dungeon was treated no differently from any other event. That is, specifically, that TD receives free event space, just as any other event, which is completely fair. Derek Guder said I was authorized to post this, and that these facts, that TD was treated as any other event in these specific regards, were not confidential. He stated, and Jeannette agreed, that I was free to post that information on the Gen Con forums, and anywhere else If you feel they were both was incorrect in telling me that, I’m sure you can address it with them.

The important thing to me is that I don’t want anyone to think that Gen Con is somehow taking some unfair advantage of TD and making them pay for event space when other events aren’t. I wouldn’t want anyone to have the misperception that Gen Con was in any way treating TD unfairly, as I’m sure you wouldn’t either. Thanks for letting me clarify this!

Marian

Sorry for the log in trouble. I have reset your password for your original account and emailed it to you. That should get your old account up and running.

I will speak with Gen Con, LLC and ask them to clarify their remarks to you. Perhaps there was a misunderstanding. I can say, at the very least, we are not treated like any other event. I wish I could say more.

Thanks for quick reply.

Thanks for the reset! Oddly, the old account is still not working even with the reset. I dunno. Just some weird glitch I guess. I'll just shut down the computer tonight and try again tomorrow. These things happen.

Oh no, I didn't mean to imply that in all aspects you're treated as any other event. Just mostly in terms of being charged for event space. But if that's incorrect, please, do feel free to correct me. I was told you're completely free to say that, but if you're not comfortable saying that without talking to GC first, sure, by all means please do so. I'm not trying to back you into a corner on this at all.

Marian wrote: Thanks for the reset! Oddly, the old account is still not working even with the reset. I dunno. Just some weird glitch I guess. I'll just shut down the computer tonight and try again tomorrow. These things happen.

Oh no, I didn't mean to imply that in all aspects you're treated as any other event. Just mostly in terms of being charged for event space. But if that's incorrect, please, do feel free to correct me. I was told you're completely free to say that, but if you're not comfortable saying that without talking to GC first, sure, by all means please do so. I'm not trying to back you into a corner on this at all.

I am able to log in with the credentials I emailed. Please try again tomorrow. Thanks for your patience.

An email has been sent to Gen Con, LLC. Thanks for bringing this to my attention. This explains a lot.

Here's my thought, not that anyone asked:

I love GenCon, probably because I don't know a lot about the behind-the-scenes stuff. But it's a business.
I love TD, in spite of knowing a bit of the behind-the-scenes stuff. The annual bloodbath that is the token development process curls your hair. But it, too, is a business.
I get the sense that Jeff is loyal and grateful to GenCon for their support through the years, and I'm sure TD would be nowhere without them.
But, TD is hitting a brick wall. There is only so much you can do one weekend a year. There are hundreds, maybe thousands of potential players who never heard of GenCon and will never go. Getting to them will create a lot of problems, but solve a lot, too. The reprint issue and others will tend to fade if the ranks of token buyers could rise.

In my imperfect opinion, the exclusivity agreement served a purpose once, but now it's getting in the way. So if TDA has the time and energy to take the show on the road, I hope they can do so without so many strings attached. And maybe we can see Jeff on Shark Tank getting a few $mil from Robert to build True Dungeon Land (tm). Say "no thanks" to Kevin...

Clearly per Jeff the agreement True Dungeon has with GENCON isn't the same as other events. I wonder how much of that difference is positive for True Dungeon and how much is negative. That would probably state how much leverage Jeff would have in getting rid of the exclusive restriction. It will be interesting to see what will happen after 2015.

My pure speculation is there is some middle ground going on here.

I suspect TD is given "some" space for free but it requires more space to actually function and is charged for that.

Just a read between the lines type of speculation, but it makes sense to me.