TOPIC: Reprint Profiteering: Just Say No

so if my auction only gets a $100 bid for a $250 token. what does that make the buyer?

while i certainly understand the sentiment, it just strike me as a bottomless pit of policing.

Wade Schwendemann (Dr. Uid) wrote: It can not possibly be that hard to hold off on selling a couple reprinted tokens.

Anyone who sells a:
Mithral Gauntlets
Nightshade's +2 Short Sword
MEC
Shield.of the Scholar

And to a lesser extent
Earcuff of Orbits
Dougal's Cloak of the Stars
Cloak of Destiny

For full, pre-2021 token development price right now should absolutely take a long hard look in the mirror and think about what they're doing. I hope you dont really think you need that extra $100-150 more than the person you're selling to.

We are literally talking about 7 tokens, and if anyone who is reselling isn't aware of what they're doing, its because they are choosing not to be. The same could be said of the buyer of course, but there are far, far more potential buyers than there are sellers.

Yes, yes, I know, Caveat Emptor.

I was taken advantage of quickly after a lucky pull back in about 2013 or so, before I was ever active on the forums or learned token values. I am thrilled it didn't really push me away from the game, but it certainly could have.

One of the greatest things about this community is the people. Don't be the assh*le who ruins it for someone.

I have more I would like to say, but you get the idea.

And yes, a several month moratorium on reprinted tokens seems exactly like the right thing to do.

Earcuff of Orbits being reprinted next year is far from a sure thing.

Mike Steele wrote:

Wade Schwendemann (Dr. Uid) wrote: It can not possibly be that hard to hold off on selling a couple reprinted tokens.

Anyone who sells a:
Mithral Gauntlets
Nightshade's +2 Short Sword
MEC
Shield.of the Scholar

And to a lesser extent
Earcuff of Orbits
Dougal's Cloak of the Stars
Cloak of Destiny

For full, pre-2021 token development price right now should absolutely take a long hard look in the mirror and think about what they're doing. I hope you dont really think you need that extra $100-150 more than the person you're selling to.

We are literally talking about 7 tokens, and if anyone who is reselling isn't aware of what they're doing, its because they are choosing not to be. The same could be said of the buyer of course, but there are far, far more potential buyers than there are sellers.

Yes, yes, I know, Caveat Emptor.

I was taken advantage of quickly after a lucky pull back in about 2013 or so, before I was ever active on the forums or learned token values. I am thrilled it didn't really push me away from the game, but it certainly could have.

One of the greatest things about this community is the people. Don't be the assh*le who ruins it for someone.

I have more I would like to say, but you get the idea.

And yes, a several month moratorium on reprinted tokens seems exactly like the right thing to do.

Earcuff of Orbits being reprinted next year is far from a sure thing.

Fair enough. The other 6 tokens then, with a disclaimer for that one.

I understand the concern, but there is just no way to police this. It all comes down to supply and demand. This same problem exists with reprinting in general, What if someone paid a large amount for the token say $500 a few weeks ago and now they learn they can get it for around $100? Thats just as likely to piss off a new player.

Now let's say that player wants to recover part of that by selling it for $250 knowing they can get it for $100? Why should they be stuck eating that money?

People should not purposesly take advantage of others, but don't be quick to vilify people for price either. A token may be worth more to someone and if someone is willing to pay for it then good for the seller and shame on the buyer if they did not the research.

What did I miss regarding the Earcuff of Orbits? Aren't the tokens finalized?

At TD Tavern I generally leave all of my pricing alone during token development. I definitely don't want to take advantage of insider information but also I realize the situation can change rapidly during that time, so trying to keep on top of how it might affect token values is tough. This reminded me to follow up and the only token I actually had in stock was Mad Evoker's Charm which I have lowered to PYP-ish prices.

One thing I find interesting is that my customers tend to react pretty quickly to the token development activity. In previous years marginal tokens that become better due to future tokens tend to get snapped up quickly. This year I had a big run on old scrolls.

Kirk Bauer wrote: What did I miss regarding the Earcuff of Orbits? Aren't the tokens finalized

Jeff stated he was leaving the reprint of Earcuff of Orbits for next year. That isn't a guarantee but it's pretty close.

So, a few folks have made comments about policing. I don't think anyone is suggesting that TPTB actively "police" this in some way. I don't think that's a good idea either.

I think this is something that's up to us as players not to engage in or condone exploitative behavior where we're intentionally and actively gouging other players, and perhaps to quietly tell our friends it's not cool if we see them doing something like that.

Daniel White wrote: Now that the 2021 print sheets are out, I've already seen a few people who appear to be trying to profiteer from the reprints by dumping tokens for which reprints have been announced.

Please don't do this. It basically exploits players who don't read the forums or pay attention to the reprint sheets. Anyone exploited in that way is going to end up with a bad taste in their mouth about the game and the community. It's toxic behavior that hurts us all. Jeff puts an incredible amount of trust in us by involving us in token discussions at all. Let's not abuse that.

+1

Wade Schwendemann (Dr. Uid) wrote: It can not possibly be that hard to hold off on selling a couple reprinted tokens.

Anyone who sells a:
Mithral Gauntlets
Nightshade's +2 Short Sword
MEC
Shield.of the Scholar

And to a lesser extent
Earcuff of Orbits
Dougal's Cloak of the Stars
Cloak of Destiny

For full, pre-2021 token development price right now should absolutely take a long hard look in the mirror and think about what they're doing. I hope you dont really think you need that extra $100-150 more than the person you're selling to.

We are literally talking about 7 tokens, and if anyone who is reselling isn't aware of what they're doing, its because they are choosing not to be. The same could be said of the buyer of course, but there are far, far more potential buyers than there are sellers.

Yes, yes, I know, Caveat Emptor.

I was taken advantage of quickly after a lucky pull back in about 2013 or so, before I was ever active on the forums or learned token values. I am thrilled it didn't really push me away from the game, but it certainly could have.

One of the greatest things about this community is the people. Don't be the assh*le who ruins it for someone.

I have more I would like to say, but you get the idea.

And yes, a several month moratorium on reprinted tokens seems exactly like the right thing to do.

+1

Kirk Bauer wrote: What did I miss regarding the Earcuff of Orbits? Aren't the tokens finalized?

At TD Tavern I generally leave all of my pricing alone during token development. I definitely don't want to take advantage of insider information but also I realize the situation can change rapidly during that time, so trying to keep on top of how it might affect token values is tough. This reminded me to follow up and the only token I actually had in stock was Mad Evoker's Charm which I have lowered to PYP-ish prices.

One thing I find interesting is that my customers tend to react pretty quickly to the token development activity. In previous years marginal tokens that become better due to future tokens tend to get snapped up quickly. This year I had a big run on old scrolls.

Kirk! I am guilty on the scroll buying here but not because of the development...I can tell you I am buying one of everything that I can use because I want to have the goods for the legendary ranger. I don't see a point in that big spend of a legendary unless I can get the full shake for it. Ranger is already "Range bound"...so maximizing within the rules is my goal. It was awesome having all the scoll choices yesterday even though I didn't need those particular ones...

Now on the topic of this, I am also seeing market swings ( my new player who just started needed to be shown the token development before he checked out his $500 of purchases...he was planning on buying a $12 Beryl Prism in that and wanted to buy my Valhalla which I didn't let him...) and given I play the markets every day, I am right at home with buy low and sell high.

I do think its like the stock market and only ONE person will get the low price and only ONE person will get the high price...if you attempt to make it "nice and even"...then its not a market anymore...its a commodity play with effective government regulation. I love a good deal...likewise, as Kirk will attest, I have spent a few more dollars (paying the high) than I should have sometimes...it really is supply-demand...but seriously, I wanted the good use at that moment...so I paid the premium...

In Orlando, we deal with price gouging all the time....This is not like the gas station at the airport selling $5.50/gallon gasoline because he knows that the business suits returning cars have already passed every other option and they are late for their flight already...this is just a player who wants to upgrade their character within a timeframe. Now I do think that someone buying the gasoline for 5.50 is stupid because even gasbuddy would have told him the price there...but for those who don't do their homework...its a good lesson to learn and may save them in a Real Life situation to pay a few more bucks for a particular token....

If someone has self-induced demand...they will spend whatever. If they want it before the reprint...which this group couldn't know...then fine...if someone prints a price higher than the reprint...fine...

I would suggest for the good of the community that because not everyone DOES read these forums, an easy "advisement" is a banner on the major token sites that says, the token development is underway and maybe have a link to the "current draft"...this will solve the "profiteering" aspect most are concerned about here...but it also could provide a real incentive for people to do some more buying because they think they see a market trend...

...um one final note...buy VXX until we see TSLA go back to an uptrend...

Jamie Campbell wrote: Kirk! I am guilty on the scroll buying here but not because of the development...

Oh and certainly there is no judgement on my part. I really enjoy supply and demand, so unless it is an obvious pricing mistake please take advantage of whatever you find that makes sense for you. Especially for scrolls it's not like we are talking life-changing money here.

Now if Jeff suddenly announces that Charms of Avarice give you +100 treasure draws, I guarantee you somebody will buy me out of CoAs within minutes. In that case, perhaps it is worth it to ask me if I still want to sell at the current asking price?

AI guess my point was that sometimes I do adjust my prices during token development but only in response to purchases. So if I have 20 of a particular rare scroll, but only 10 currently for sale at $2/ea, and then those sell out, my price for the rest of them will go up. Although much of that is automated on my side.

Technically, nightshade’s isn’t a reprint but is really close to being one.

I completely agree that the community should frown on profiteering on reprints.

Fred