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TOPIC: Which Relic to make first?

Which Relic to make first? 6 months 5 days ago #1

  • jedibcg
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EDIT: I just realized I may have already asked this before I making the Legendary Lute. But I don't remember.


Hey all

Post Origins I should have enough to make (or be very very close) either Necklace of the Sneak or Shaman’s Greater Necklace. I will likely have enough to make the other post Gen Con.

So the question is which should I have possible available for Gen Con do you think?

You can answer just based upon that but if you want more information about the party make-up here comes a lot of possibly useless information.

My group is varied so I don't know who is likely to show up for any given run until maybe a month before Gen Con. Even then I almost never know what anyone is going to play until we all sit down in the coaching room. Because of this I have 12 builds, one for each character. Anyone can play whatever they like with 3 required classes starting this year. Someone must play the bard, cleric and druid. this is because I have eldritch locked in on these characters to get them to level 5 and 7 Rings of Heroism for which ever 7 other characters are chosen.

It may seem like I should choose the necklace for the Druid because they are always guaranteed to see play. However is the druid likely to polymorph at the relic level? At legendary yes because you can continue to case spells and speak. Once polymorphed the relic level does do 2 more damage on average than the +3 Baton of Focus. The Baton though is likely to be my next legendary (eventually) so at that point it doesn't do more damage, but just gain the elemental damage reduction. Choosing the relic necklace does mean the Druid loses 1 to healing. I built the druid to be a support healer after the cleric. Would I be building the relic just to build it and equip it? Well yes. There is no question of that. It is just if it should happen before Gen Con or not.

So it sounds like I am leaning toward the Necklace of the Sneak. Well not exactly. I built the rogue as a ranged rogue.....kind of. I don't have the Lenses of Vital Sight. So traditionally the rogue does 1 Round of Melee with Sneak Attack and then switches to the bow. They do more damage (as built) with the bow than melee but not as much as with the addition of the sneak attack damage. It is true I am leaning toward the potential +40 damage per game from a rogue (being able to improved sneak attack 2 extra times). However if the rogue isn't played then that is a relic that isn't used for Gen Con.
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Last edit: by jedibcg.

Which Relic to make first? 6 months 5 days ago #2

I would make the rogue one unless you decide to build for a poly druid, but that's just me.
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Which Relic to make first? 6 months 5 days ago #3

What does your Druid's playstyle normally look like? Are they using a lot of heals during combat, or are they mainly trying to get damage in and healing after the round is done?

What would you be running in the neck slot for either character should you -not- craft it?

I think, given the parameters you've laid out, the Rogue is the stronger of the two upgrades for your group, but given that you -always- run the Druid, it's worth making the Druid relic instead.

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Which Relic to make first? 6 months 5 days ago #4

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As I don't know who will be playing the Druid I cannot provide a play style. That said with the nerf to LoDS I am predicting we will need all our heals and then some.

Druid would have Necklace of Focus and rogue Exalted Creeper Amulet.
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Which Relic to make first? 6 months 5 days ago #5

Rogue

Polymorphing is not a core activity for druid. In our group, a druid has never polymorphed.

Now, since I don't like playing rogue and I do like playing druid, I am working on druid transmutes, but I would still be willing to play druid without ever polymorphing.

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Which Relic to make first? 6 months 4 days ago #6

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jedibcg wrote: As I don't know who will be playing the Druid I cannot provide a play style. That said with the nerf to LoDS I am predicting we will need all our heals and then some.

Druid would have Necklace of Focus and rogue Exalted Creeper Amulet.


Agree on healing, especially at higher difficulty levels.
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Which Relic to make first? 6 months 4 days ago #7

Maybe hold off until next year to see which classes get their relics?
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Which Relic to make first? 6 months 4 days ago #8

Milambus (Jake) wrote: Maybe hold off until next year to see which classes get their relics?

Next year will be
Paladin
Monk
Ranger
Barbarian

The year after
Cleric
Fighters
Wizards
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Which Relic to make first? 6 months 4 days ago #9

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Milambus (Jake) wrote: Maybe hold off until next year to see which classes get their relics?


As long as I am playing with my group come next year I will be making those relics as well. I might not make them next year but the following year but the plan is always to make at least 1 of every relic and have the components (UR's and Rares) to be able to make the legendary at some point down the road.
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Which Relic to make first? 6 months 4 days ago #10

Personally, I'd say the Rogue necklace. First - anyone with BoFW absolutely needs their feet slot free. Second - the benefits for the necklace are pretty good compared to just the shoes. The shoes only allow for a second sneak attack once per run - that's it. By themselves, they aren't even second or third best in slot for a rogue. However, when you move into the necklaces - things change dramatically. Key benefits of the necklace: Increased crit range, no need to hood of elvenkind or similar to sneak in the first round, and you get the sneak attack a second time 2/game. An increased crit range when combined with a +2 nightshades' or a viper set means your sneak gets crit multipliers. Alternately, use the assassin's crossbow and get the X3 on damage excluding sneak (when using the lenses of vital insight).

Personally, I already got the legendary rogue one because it is, far and away, best in slot for a rogue. The 17-20 crit range and using the abilities every room combine for an interesting combination. I'll go from 60ish damage for a sneak attack max damage last year to well over 100 and be able to do it twice per room. Suddenly, rogue is in the top 5 for damage (if you can get a 17 or better half the time).

Interestingly, the difference between the necklace and belt for the druid isn't huge - it's important but you still lose spell-casting. The legendary one is pretty significant as it allows most everything.
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Wizard build
truedungeon.com/forum?view=topic&catid=570&id=247398

Rogue build
truedungeon.com/forum?view=topic&catid=569&id=245490#287189

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truedungeon.com/forum?view=topic&catid=583&id=247555

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Which Relic to make first? 6 months 4 days ago #11

Fred K wrote: Interestingly, the difference between the necklace and belt for the druid isn't huge - it's important but you still lose spell-casting. The legendary one is pretty significant as it allows most everything.


I really dont get why so many think of the druid necklace in terms of 'not allowing spell casting'. That is a really backward way to think of it...and also completely untrue.
First, if you want to cast spells, just dont polymorph. Sure, that means if there is a combat where you want to cast instead of slide, your relic doesnt do anything, but thats the same for any item that works in one type of combat and not others (i havent seen people complain that their girdle only helps melee but not spells). And if you are casting, all the relic would get you is the DR.
ALSO, good news, you actually CAN have that DR every other round even while casting.
Round 1: cast then polymorph to elemental.
Have DR
Round 2: turn back to human, then cast.
No DR
Round 3: cast then polymorph to elemental again.
DR again...


Now, all that said, get the druid item first iff your druid will use it as primary attack. Otherwise, the rogue item is far better.
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Which Relic to make first? 6 months 3 days ago #12

The problem with what you propose is the new limits on times you can polymorph into an elemental form.

It goes to the basic function of a druid. They are the most versatile class. With a spirit bowl - they can sit in as the rogue or bard. Because of their spellcasting - their spell damage can rival a wizard. They are the second best healers. Finally, they are decent in combat via polymorph.

The new relic has a flaw that it optimizes one specific direction of a druid but, even so, wouldn't put it into the top 3 for damage. It's interesting but, arguably, not the best transmute this year. The legendary version allows spellcasting only limiting scrolls overcoming that limitation (for the most part).

Fred
What do we want? Evidence based science! When do we want it? After peer review!

Wizard build
truedungeon.com/forum?view=topic&catid=570&id=247398

Rogue build
truedungeon.com/forum?view=topic&catid=569&id=245490#287189

Items for Sale or Trade
truedungeon.com/forum?view=topic&catid=583&id=247555

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