TOPIC: Safehold Program Targeted Feedback on Rules > Part THREE

Thanks for the great feedback during the last round. I hope we are close to a polished document, but I would be happy to make any other changes y'all can find that need fixing.

Changes I can remember making:

-- Fixed lots of error y'all found
-- Lots of suggested tweaks to make things more clear (sorry...you need to read the whole thing again!)
-- Changed the Underling Rogue to Missile (from Ranged) and changed the Underling Cleric to simulate getting a protective blessing from said Cleric before you leave for your adventure.
-- Followers: I tweaked the Dragonkin and Fiend so that the relative power of all the slot expander choices are more equal. Since you only get 1 Follower, I'd be good if there were harder choices.
-- Added an extra circle in the design of the Tier 1 Mythic tokens so they are different from Tier 2.

Thanks again!

Safehold Program Details

LINK UPDATED - should get rid of cache issues...

Looks amazing Jeff!

Looks good. There's some minor overlap in damage in case of Druid melee and focus damage but for me looks good to ship. Definitely enjoy that the Hedgehogs are getting some love.....could even make the damage it does Sacred damage since it IS from a cleric

I'll make one last pitch to remove the statements about these tokens "never being available in treasure."

TD never has to put these into the treasure mix.

But making this guarantee can only cause problems down the line.

You can see in the prior rules thread that it took all of 25 minutes for people to begin to grasp onto that rule and try to broaden it to match their own interpretation of the "spirit of the rule" by requesting further limitations be guaranteed (that Safehold related tokens will never be distributed in any way to Golden Ticket holders as part of that program).

Anyway - I feel there is a chance this wording will come back to bite TD down the line - similar to the fracas and hard feelings around the guarantee to not reprint the Horn of Plenty and the creation of the Charm of Avarice.

What's the benefit of making this guarantee?

Is there any plan for having access to 6th lvl class cards besides Safehold I down the road? Very much a feel bad if it's going to be locked purely to Safehold.

All great changes, Jeff! Looks great!

Forgive me if this has been asked and answered, but for the Follower Dragonkin and Follower Fiend, are the extra slots granted still subject to the 10 Charm and 9 Ioun Stone overall limits? In other words, does equipping Follower Fiend mean you get up to 12 Charms, or does it mean you can replace Arcane Earcuff or Charm Bracelets and still get up to 10 Charms?

Matthew Hayward wrote: I'll make one last pitch to remove the statements about these tokens "never being available in treasure."

TD never has to put these into the treasure mix.

But making this guarantee can only cause problems down the line.

You can see in the prior rules thread that it took all of 25 minutes for people to begin to grasp onto that rule and try to broaden it to match their own interpretation of the "spirit of the rule" by requesting further limitations be guaranteed (that Safehold related tokens will never be distributed in any way to Golden Ticket holders as part of that program).

Anyway - I feel there is a chance this wording will come back to bite TD down the line - similar to the fracas and hard feelings around the guarantee to not reprint the Horn of Plenty and the creation of the Charm of Avarice.

What's the benefit of making this guarantee?

I agree, I think it should be fine for these to simply not be added to treasure boxes without any need to make a written commitment to never do so in the future. A lot could change as the Safehold program progresses over the next few years.

On the summary chart on page 1, the benefit column of the last line reads:

5 Master Mythic Transmuter tokens
(May create any Mythic Token)

First, "Transmuter" should also be in bold as it is part of the name of the token. Second, perhaps the parenthetical can be reworded to "(Creates any Mythic token)" or "(Creates any Tier Mythic token)" for parallelism with every other row in the chart.

Under Safehold IV (page 3):

you can only equip one Underling unless you have a Safehold I (in which case you may have up to two Underlings.

there's a vestigial open parenthesis that should be removed.

Under Safehold II (page 5):

These tokens are created when a Safehold II – Under Construction token is used and transmuted into a Safehold II token.

This should probably be reword to avoid implying all four tokens shown come with the Safehold II. As much as I'd love arguing for a free Mythic Girdle in a few years, I'm pretty sure that's not the intention!

Under the same section:

The recipe to make a Safehold I token requires a Safehold II token.

All previous sections instead mention the previous token that is required to make the current one under discussion, not the token the current one under discussion transmutes into.

Under Trainer Limits (Hirelings, Underlings and Followers) (page 5):
The first statement of the fourth bullet is still a sentence fragment.

Under More About Mythic Tokens (page 5):
Since the statement about Mythic tokens never appearing outside of this program has been updated to state all Safehold tokens shall never appear outside this program, that paragraph should be moved up More Details (page 1).

Under Omni Cube & Omni Orb Tokens (page 6):
While it's already clear on the image, perhaps it would be wise to reiterate one more time that the Omni Orb (that replaces a UR) cannot be used to create in-print Relic tokens, since Relics are not Legendaries.

There appears to be a blank page 7 in the document.

BeLinda Mathie wrote: Forgive me if this has been asked and answered, but for the Follower Dragonkin and Follower Fiend, are the extra slots granted still subject to the 10 Charm and 9 Ioun Stone overall limits? In other words, does equipping Follower Fiend mean you get up to 12 Charms, or does it mean you can replace Arcane Earcuff or Charm Bracelets and still get up to 10 Charms?

I was thinking the same thing. I’d like to see the Ioun stone upped by one if this is what is going to hit the printer.

I’d really like to see the avarice dropped to a tier 2 mythic. First there was already people purchasing beads this year knowing the recipe was going to require them.
2nd were not expecting 5 tiers of progressively increasing paywall in front of it. I think this will probably create a lot of hard feelings.

3rd you need under this proposal 1x safehold 1 per an avarice.

Right now if the only mythic you are willing to budget for is the new avarice it’s going to cost

1 CoA $1500
3 TE beads $300
Tier 1 kicker $2000
Safehold 2 800
Safehold 1 1000
$5600 total,

I’m not counting the other 3 levels of safehold because I see the value in them. Safehold 2 and safehold 1 are about making mythics

Dropping the avarice to a mythic 2 will get the price down to $3,600 and that’s still a lot but it’s less likely to run off players than the other price tag.

If I understand something wrong please correct me so I understand.

Wayne Rhodes wrote: I’d really like to see the avarice dropped to a tier 2 mythic. First there was already people purchasing beads this year knowing the recipe was going to require them.
2nd were not expecting 5 tiers of progressively increasing paywall in front of it. I think this will probably create a lot of hard feelings.

3rd you need under this proposal 1x safehold 1 per an avarice.

Right now if the only mythic you are willing to budget for is the new avarice it’s going to cost

1 CoA $1500
3 TE beads $300
Tier 1 kicker $2000
Safehold 2 800
Safehold 1 1000
$5600 total,

I’m not counting the other 3 levels of safehold because I see the value in them. Safehold 2 and safehold 1 are about making mythics

Dropping the avarice to a mythic 2 will get the price down to $3,600 and that’s still a lot but it’s less likely to run off players than the other price tag.

If I understand something wrong please correct me so I understand.

Agreed completely.