TOPIC: TRUE DUNGEON PVP

I have seen people joke about this concept but I believe it could be something very unique if done right.

Why not PVP?...All I have been seeing is complaints about over powered players dominating the Dungeon...Rude behaviour and newbies getting stepped on because the veteran player is so powerful... PVP could channel much of that bravado.

Think about it..In most MMO's that have PVP if a character gets to big for their britches they are usually requested to attend the PVP zone...It could be a winner takes all type thing. You may be powerful in the dungeon but what about facing the reigning TD champ? Or you could have teams fighting teams...In an all out dungeon smack down... Imagine the treasure that could be awarded to the victors and the unique role play. It could be a side event that would channel the veterans and Uber power players. Like..You better be a all purped out veteran or you will be sliced and diced rather quickly. Think of the scenarios you could come up with and think about the treasure. When I played PVP MMO's We used to play for Purple drops and treasure... Why not have a TD version of the same concept? Yes I know you will say its impossible..Gotcha... But What if?

Been done before. Went all to !#%^ and almost everyone who participated left pissed. It was basically one shot kills because of the way tokens are designed where damage far outstrips AC/HP. Whoever got to go first pretty much wins unless their equip is laughably outmatched.

A new system could be worked out that solves that issue. It just seems that it could work if done correctly. Like make the payoff worth it. Really worth it! Put some real juicy bate on the hook. Most of the vets are wanting treasure. They will dominate a teams effort to get that pay off. Channel that into a fight that can handle them..Also Wouldn't it be cool if Smoke or one of the Giant Spiders could be on your team? Stuff like that.

Sometimes getting pissed is part of the fun... For some any way...

I don't understand what makes you think a new event, which would require lots of planning and volunteer resources, would actually fix any of the issues though. Why would vets do _less_ dungeon runs? Wouldn't they just play this PVP whatever as well as their dungeon runs? It doesn't seem like there's a need for it and I can only see it causing acrimony. There was a version of PVP for a while where pretty much no tokens were allowed (Barring one in a mug) called the Bar Brawl. It was a lot of fun and almost everyone liked it but it did cost volunteer resources which the admins decided could be better used elsewhere.

In Grind this year my Dwarf Fighter did 99 points of damage to Son Of Smoak with my first slide. 99 points. PvP is a bad idea (using Tokens).

henwy wrote: I don't understand what makes you think a new event, which would require lots of planning and volunteer resources, would actually fix any of the issues though. Why would vets do _less_ dungeon runs? Wouldn't they just play this PVP whatever as well as their dungeon runs? It doesn't seem like there's a need for it and I can only see it causing acrimony. There was a version of PVP for a while where pretty much no tokens were allowed (Barring one in a mug) called the Bar Brawl. It was a lot of fun and almost everyone liked it but it did cost volunteer resources which the admins decided could be better used elsewhere.

Yeah, I do think outside the box. It could inspire and attract in my opinion. Bar Brawl PVP is a fantastic concept. I think if done correctly it would be a great addition again. I vote one single solitary vote that the idea is re visited. Planning and resource generation is what sharp creative souls do. Asking an engineer to engineer is not a big stretch. Build it and they shall come! Think about it.. They are already talking about splitting some things up like the store and other aspects and having them move off site.. Who knows? Maybe something like that could happen with PVP in a room in the Marriott or one of the small convention rooms in one of the hotels but have some cool TD creatures and characters and Dungeon environment. It could be a great way to advertise the token business and maybe even open up some space in the Dungeon itself if certain things were consolidated. You know it could be like a mini event durring the event.. You are offering Dungeon runs PVP store True Grind Transmutation..etc.. I just believe it could work..It has worked but needs fine tuned..

How would you suggest it be fine-tuned, Arthur? When it comes to PvP, veterans are all glass cannons. High damage bonus, high to-hit, low AC. Combat in the dungeon works because the monster can usually only target 1-2 people at a time.

It really would come down to whoever got to strike first unless you capped bonuses or restricted tokens. The minute you do that, interest will wane. "Oh, I can't use all of my cool stuff? Well never mind then..." And henwy is right - it would not at all keep veterans out of anything, they would just add it to their list of TD experiences to get in.

Not to mention the difficulty for the DM. Right now, he or she needs to memorize/reference 3 different versions of the monster and for the most part needs to know the Normal monster stats. But with PvP it would be a constant back and forth checking two different characters for every match. It would be exhausting, it would be frustrating.

No one is trying to tell you to not think outside the box - suggesting new ideas is what keeps TD going. But this horse has already been beaten to death, there is nothing to be gained by flogging the corpse.

PvP has already existed before as both True Brawl and True Arena.

True Brawl was an unmitigated disaster since player damage is not correctly scaled to player HP. To make it work, you would need to completely redesign all of the character cards.

True Arena was successful, and had some pretty good rewards. However, it was run in the Tavern, which no longer exists. And nowadays, with the drastic power level discrepancy in tokens I don't think it would be a good idea without severe limits on allowable tokens. Otherwise it would just be another case of "the rich get richer." A slightly different version was a Tavern Brawl which didn't allow tokens to be used.

In addition, either event would require significant volunteer resources and scarce space. A few years ago, there was a forumite who expressed interest in redesigning True Brawl but nothing ever really materialized with that.

If you capped PvP at different levels, like rare/uncommon and lower, or only commons that MIGHT work. It still comes down to more space and more volunteers needed vs what is the upside? You could also offer a virtual shop that lets you outfit a character/group, but you are given a set amount of GP beforehand. I would like to see something like the last option, with an arena setting for viewers

Zombie flogged horse PVP.....I like it. The devil is in the details. You simply stated the old concept and model...trash that. If the player wants to be able to use all of their powers then the concept should be based on that. Giving them what they want is the goal. Think about how many rooms are planned for in the main event? The PVP could be a smaller sleaker model. Kind of like Hoosier Con. A new system for 1 vs 1 battle and with TD bosses and monsters able to take part. Strictly combat based. Let go of the old rules. Base a system around what is wanted and what would be needed to achieve it. From a business point of view having something that can give you a True Dungeon thrill that is smaller and able to provide combat challenges is a good investment. How easy would it be to have at smaller conventions..Keeping the public satisfied with having access to TD more than one or two times a year..Having a smaller PVP based version of TD that gives treasure and allows full power use with group battle and or Bosses or monsters would be really cool in my opinion. Think about how much is spent on a big full TD event.. And how much space is needed and many people you need.. A PVP based smaller scale version of TD that only needs one or two convention rooms to achieve would be logical and financially possible for all involved. a smaller hall..Heck a convention room would mean lower rate of a ticket to experience what TD is all about but offer a incredible fight exerience. I saw a lot of complaints about people saying they were not getting enough for their $52 ticket... Something smaller and new could be offered more frequently and set up easier and easier to get required help. See it is not the size of your event but what you do with it.

I love the idea of Arena where people could watch!!!!