TOPIC: Alert! Fake Tokens...

Hi Everyone,

I've been balancing scheduling issues, but can finally chime in. I sold Josh Rod Segments 4, 5 and 6 via EBay. I am certain that I purchased segments 4 & 5 from EBay in 2012-2013. I could have sworn that segment 6 had come from 2013 T.D. (direct) purchases, but I'm not sure. When Josh contacted me about the forgeries, I was surprised but attempted to resolve the concerns. I worked with Josh and hope we reached a workable solution, including a public apology for my mistake.

Regardless of circumstances, I am party to the duress that upset Josh. Due to my ignorance of the fakes, I hurt a valued customer. Now, that I'm aware of the potential for nearly any token to be fake, I'll be more diligent. I thought I had a handle on fakes, but I have room for improvement. Again, my apologies to Josh and the T.D. community.

Dennis
Proprietor of "Is Another's Treasure" Shop

Dennis,

At this point are we sure they were fakes? It still seems unlikely that he would end up with 6 out of 7 tokens that were fake. Especially since one came from Jeff...

And as a fellow retailer I'd still love to know how to screen my own tokens for fakes before I potentially resell one...

The fakes taste like chicken.

Something I have noticed with this year's tokens is that either the paper is thicker, or there are two layers. When you slide your finger from the dimpled edge towards the 'decal', you can feel the edge. Previous year's tokens do not have that. Not sure if that helps going forward.

balthasar wrote: Something I have noticed with this year's tokens is that either the paper is thicker, or there are two layers. When you slide your finger from the dimpled edge towards the 'decal', you can feel the edge. Previous year's tokens do not have that. Not sure if that helps going forward.

Just checked several older and current tokens and you are correct. It is a very tiny difference but it is a difference.

Yup. I found a few older ones with an edge you can feel, but not all the way around. I think those are due to the label being slightly off center.

This whole situation has been sort of messy. Dennis, thank you for your great kindness through this interesting predicament. The public apology was not necessary but is appreciated.

Assuming the tokens are fakes, it's upsetting that some mischievous person/people can attempt to soil a fun and engaging game and community like this to make a couple bucks.

Thanks again to Laz and also to Kubu, both of whom were more than accommodating with trying to help with the situation. I don't want to speak for the folks involved, but I get the sense that these guys might not have a clear, definitive answer to the question of where the tokens came from, which is understandable given that they deal in large sums of tokens and trades.

As to the rest of it, this will be the last public statement I make about this subject. I truly enjoy this game and while this situation was unfortunate, I am not going to allow it to impact the fun I have with friends while playing TD. Jeff works hard to put out a great product that I enjoy taking part in each year.

The majority of the story has been expressed in various posts in this thread but if you are interested in discussing it more, feel free to PM me with your questions (groovycoop in the PM section) I will do my best to respond with any answers I have.
Thanks.

At this point, the best thing to do is put it all on the back burner and wait for jeff to find the time to sort things out. I'm sure he'll get back to us when he can find the time and honestly, this whole issue isn't going to blow up anytime soon if it's been simmering this long.

Kirk Bauer wrote: Dennis,

At this point are we sure they were fakes? It still seems unlikely that he would end up with 6 out of 7 tokens that were fake. Especially since one came from Jeff...

And as a fellow retailer I'd still love to know how to screen my own tokens for fakes before I potentially resell one...

Quite possible that the Rod Segments were not (all) fakes. That, I can watch for. But my major concern was the duress that Josh suffered. I hope I turned my role in this into a reason for Josh to stay with us, instead of leaving. My goal was to learn from the mistakes that occurred. Now . . . to get a better handle on these damn forgeries!

Josh Coopman wrote: This whole situation has been sort of messy. Dennis, thank you for your great kindness through this interesting predicament. The public apology was not necessary but is appreciated.

Assuming the tokens are fakes, it's upsetting that some mischievous person/people can attempt to soil a fun and engaging game and community like this to make a couple bucks.

Thanks again to Laz and also to Kubu, both of whom were more than accommodating with trying to help with the situation. I don't want to speak for the folks involved, but I get the sense that these guys might not have a clear, definitive answer to the question of where the tokens came from, which is understandable given that they deal in large sums of tokens and trades.

As to the rest of it, this will be the last public statement I make about this subject. I truly enjoy this game and while this situation was unfortunate, I am not going to allow it to impact the fun I have with friends while playing TD. Jeff works hard to put out a great product that I enjoy taking part in each year.

The majority of the story has been expressed in various posts in this thread but if you are interested in discussing it more, feel free to PM me with your questions (groovycoop in the PM section) I will do my best to respond with any answers I have.
Thanks.

Thanks Josh. I hope you stay with us.

The Rod Segments that were forged, may have been done by someone out of desparation. The power represented within certain tokens can be tempting and lead some to rash actions. We have a diverse group of folks, with different budgets. I would be willing to bet any forgeries made were used to trade for legitimate tokens (& maybe cash?) But any person that does this practice, puts True Dungeon at the risk of being financially insolvent. The True Dungeon economy is a fragile system, that can not easily recover from fraud. The group of people that create the economy is fairly small (~8,000 people.) Honesty and each of us living within our limits will keep True Dungeon going. A dash of generosity will hopefully help the game grow!

To those that would consider forging tokens, please don't. Though there may be short term rewards, the long term reality is that True Dungeon's economy will suffer. Enough of an erosion, and the whole enterprise could collapse. Personally, I don't want to see the greatest gaming experience at GenCon suffer, let alone die. Let's work to keep our game alive and thriving.

Dennis Burdick wrote:
Thanks Josh. I hope you stay with us.

The Rod Segments that were forged, may have been done by someone out of desparation. The power represented within certain tokens can be tempting and lead some to rash actions.

Desperation, desire to own, or just money.

I've seen a completed Rod on a few sites selling for over $3,500.00

That's a tempting hunk of change for someone.

Void