TOPIC: Alert! Fake Tokens...

They haven't reached the end of the 5th book yet, but have taken quite a few departures to keep popular characters in the spotlight. They replaced Ramsay's wedding to Jeyne with him marrying Sansa.

Not trying to derail the Game of Thrones thread, but I said I would update everyone once I was able to speak to the parties involved. I was also asked to give Jeff some time to gather his thoughts on the issue while he was traveling on his son's trip. I was trying to respect him as well.

First off, a BIG thank you to Jeff. He made me whole despite everything. I can't thank him enough. I received my RoSP today!

Secondly, I chatted with the individuals involved and I truly believe they also had no idea the tokens were fakes. Call me naive, or a moron, or whatever you want, but they all seemed just as shocked as I was about it.

The three I got the tokens from were Lazlo, Kubu, and Dennis Burdick.

I won't speak for them and will allow them to tell their side of the story, but please put down the pitchforks. I truly believe these folks when they say they had no idea they were fake tokens.

Again, not trying to stir the pot, I just owed the community an update. Please forgive the delay.

Josh Coopman wrote:
Again, not trying to stir the pot, I just owed the community an update. Please forgive the delay.

Thanks for the update. After seeing who the parts came from I can say that I would never EVER think any of those three would counterfeit a token. I have personally dealt with all three and feel that they are more than trustworthy.

I trust those three also, but it's scary that out of your seven rod segments you got three fake tokens (at least) from three different sources. That makes it sound like the problem is more widespread than I'd thought - unless perhaps those three all unwittingly obtained the fake tokens from the same source.

Mike Steele wrote: I trust those three also, but it's scary that out of your seven rod segments you got three fake tokens (at least) from three different sources. That makes it sound like the problem is more widespread than I'd thought - unless perhaps those three all unwittingly obtained the fake tokens from the same source.

But as Jeff said in his second post in this thread, "I am not 100% certain of anything at this point." I take that to mean that the tokens still might be real but that there were anomalies of some sort. We won't know until Jeff gets back with us.

Grats on your Rosp! and you made me laugh out loud derailing the game of thrones thread

I agree. I seriously doubt that any of those three were the creators of fake tokens.

It is worthwhile to figure out who is/was.

Also, I think like most token buyers, I have no idea how easy it is to spot a fake.

Frankly, I'm not even certain the tokens were really fake at this point. Here's the simple fact of it....

1) Fakes up to this point have been of clearly inferior quality. Of the 3-4 I've seen, none have borne up to the barest scrutiny.

2) If it's confirmed they came from the sources they did, then we have to assume that this generation of fakes is good enough to fool people who deal with tokens incredibly often, being large buyers/sellers.

3) The odds of someone buying 7 tokens and having _6_ of them being fake from 3 separate sellers given both #1 and #2 are astronomical.

Even if you believe that maybe good quality, practically indistinguishable fakes have been around for a while and have unknowningly flooded the market all this time (which is the only way #3 makes any sense), the idea that TD would have only detected them now and only with this transmute makes no sense. We should all, those of us who trade regularly, have fakes in our possession and they would be so perfect in their replication as to be de facto real.

This is the simple, logical reasoning. When we didn't know where the tokens had come from, it makes sense to consider that no one is unlucky enough to get 6 out of 7 fakes, buying from 3-4 different sellers. So if the tokens are fake, then the only alternative to the transmuter being suspect is that everyone is flooded with fakes or there's a cabal of sellers spanning across the biggest token sellers across the community conspiring to pass them. If you don't buy that then the only other reasonable conclusion is that there was a mistake and 6 out of 7 tokens weren't fake to begin with.

henwy wrote: Frankly, I'm not even certain the tokens were really fake at this point. Here's the simple fact of it....

1) Fakes up to this point have been of clearly inferior quality. Of the 3-4 I've seen, none have borne up to the barest scrutiny.

2) If it's confirmed they came from the sources they did, then we have to assume that this generation of fakes is good enough to fool people who deal with tokens incredibly often, being large buyers/sellers.

3) The odds of someone buying 6 tokens and having _7_ of them being fake from 3 separate sellers given both #1 and #2 are astronomical.

Even if you believe that maybe good quality, practically indistinguishable fakes have been around for a while and have unknowningly flooded the market all this time (which is the only way #3 makes any sense), the idea that TD would have only detected them now and only with this transmute makes no sense. We should all, those of us who trade regularly, have fakes in our possession and they would be so perfect in their replication as to be de facto real.

This is the simple, logical reasoning. When we didn't know where the tokens had come from, it makes sense to consider that no one is unlucky enough to get 6 out of 7 fakes, buying from 3-4 different sellers. So if the tokens are fake, then the only alternative to the transmuter being suspect is that everyone is flooded with fakes or there's a cabal of sellers spanning across the biggest token sellers across the community conspiring to pass them. If you don't buy that then the only other reasonable conclusion is that there was a mistake and 6 out of 7 tokens weren't fake to begin with.

I probably haven't read all the posts - did it say somewhere that 6 of the 7 Rod Segments were fake?

truedungeon.com/forum?func=view&catid=580&id=222143&limit=12&start=12#222202

I hate to agree with Henwy , but I was thinking the same thing.
So it sounds like we wait another few days to hear what Jeff finds out.

So we are now assuming they were just abnormal until Jeff gets a chance to examine them closer?