TOPIC: Common practice?

I was really looking forward to True Dungeon at WYC, its was going to be my first experience, read all the rules but what happened during my first time really saddens me a lot, I had a group that had already done the Dungeon that day, so they gave hints and stuff thoughout the whole process ruining the whole element of what a surpise is supposed to be in a Dungeon, I felt this ruined the whole process and point of the surprise of the Dungeon, is this a common practice that people run through the same senerio multiple times, ruining it for the others that hadn't been through it yet? if this is a common practice is there way to seperate those people from the ones that have not ran through it yet? I thought if I had liked it (which I did, but not as much as I could) I was going to do it at GENCON as well, but if this is common practice then not sure, I wanted opinions.

Thanks.

It is common for players to do multiple runs. That being said them ruining it for you is bad form. The Dungeon at WYC were classic dungeons as well, so alot has seen them in previous years as well. Give it a try at GenCon if you can where they will be all new dungeons.

If you told them at the outset that you were new and wanted to be surprised, they were just immature twerps. If you never told them you were new and wanted to be surprised, then it's on you.

Many veteran TD players don't want to run with new people because the disparity in tokens and hence abilities can be gigantic. If we do find ourselves in a group with new players, it just takes a little maturity to not reveal upcoming experiences and almost all TD veterans have that.

I did three runs and on the second and third runs we separated into those who knew the puzzle and those who didn't. We only gave hints if they wanted it or if it was a treasure room and in the last minute.

They should have asked if anybody hadn't been through before, and if they didn't you should have mentioned it. But as the apparent veteran players they should have been more considerate either way. Sorry about your experience.

Sometimes adrenaline takes over and people forget.
That sort of thing can happen but the majority of players are cool about helping new players enjoy their first experience. But loot is loot, so they'll want to be sure the treasure room gets solved before the horn.

If you say something in the coaching room, the veterans should respect you enough to not be jerks.

But if you don't want to chance it, there are ways to minimize or eliminate the odds.

Try to get the earliest runs on Thursday. No one has seen the rooms yet, but the trade-off is these sometimes don't sell out, or people get stuck in that gawdawful badge line and miss the run. Running with a smaller party isn't necessarily bad, so don't sweat it.

If you have a lot of friends, TD is the only event at GenCon that allows one person to buy all ten tickets for the same time slot. If you want zero chance of this happening again, you could pool your resources and take the whole run. This also gives you the chance to get organized ahead of time as to who is playing what.

If you have the resources you could buy all ten on spec and sell the rest here. Advertise as a newbie run. I've never heard of anyone failing to sell their extra tickets, and make it clear that vets who spoil the run for the newbies will be beaten and dumped behind a rock.

But you shouldn't have to go that far.

I once accidentally ruined a puzzle room for some players, I've learned since then to ask and step back if there are players who have not done the room and let take command, hints only in the last 2 minutes or so.

on behalf of foolish people like I was, I'm sorry it happened to you and hope you give the Gencon runs a chance, the earlier you do the run the better, and if you can get in on any of the forum created runs, you should have good runs then.

Thanks everyone for their reply just wanted another one view besides mine and take on what to expect later, but by all means I wanted to point out I wasn't mad over the situation just a little disappointed they paid there money and just as much right to be there as me. For the most part(for who they were) they did well, there were just a few things here and there that ruined the surprise but weren't always done on purpose either. Mainly yes I am may not be the sharpest light bulb in the pack by all means. But I am quite observant and see most things and hear them to, and that's where some of things that ruined it was, with them talking amoungst themselves quietly or some of their mannerism.

thanks everyone and I do hope to enjoy more Dungeons in the future.

Chad,

I am sorry that people ruined the surprise on your run for you. It does take a bit of the luster off the dungeon for me when things are spoiled. I am glad to hear that you are willing to give TD another try at GenCon. I would look on the forums to find groups of players that would be willing to group up, rather than a PUG (Pick Up Group) if you can.

I normally tell people if I've run it that I have and won't be making any decisions for the group on puzzles, and will put out there that I will give clues or help if needed. We normally hang back and help out with fights and if directly asked for the solution will provide it, or if it's a treasure room will tell them a minute before we will solve it so people get the treasure. We do tell them this up front. We want people to work and enjoy solving puzzles and beating monsters.

I believe the last PUG we did for fun, the people were very happy and appreciative that we kind hung back and let them direct and solve it and didn't spoil it or one shot the monster.

Chad McCallister wrote: Thanks everyone for their reply just wanted another one view besides mine and take on what to expect later, but by all means I wanted to point out I wasn't mad over the situation just a little disappointed they paid there money and just as much right to be there as me. For the most part(for who they were) they did well, there were just a few things here and there that ruined the surprise but weren't always done on purpose either. Mainly yes I am may not be the sharpest light bulb in the pack by all means. But I am quite observant and see most things and hear them to, and that's where some of things that ruined it was, with them talking amoungst themselves quietly or some of their mannerism.

thanks everyone and I do hope to enjoy more Dungeons in the future.

was it every room..or just room 6. if room 6, i could see that because they didnt want to use a potion of deaths door on you... other than that, they should have been more considerate

The first time I ran, we had a veteran player (who clearly had done it before) with us. I didn't realize some things then, but I see them now, about that player. He was awesome. I'm sharing this to give kudos to that guy, but also to illustrate how a veteran appears and can interact with people that aren't as geared/knowledgeable about the run.

First off, the group was, I think 8 noobs, 1 person that had played before, and 1 veteran guy who had a box of epic stuff.

- He loaned us weapon tokens, but not to a degree that we didn't know what to do. Loaning was good for a new person (A shiny weapon! I see what it does!); but a bunch of tokens to remember with additional functions, no. I had no concept of what a rare token even looked like, so even just being told 'red is great' by the veteran was VERY helpful. Anyway, loaning is good, but so is limiting the loaning to just a few things, and he knew this.

- He did a strange combat thing where he put his slider on the board as a backstop. At the time I had no idea what he was doing, but now I see that he was letting US defeat the monster. Good for him. I didn't realize at the time that he'd probably destroy the monster if he had attacked, and was letting us do it. I thought it was a rogue special ability! .. but he was actually assisting without actively hitting. Great choice.

Less awesome:
- He was a rogue and seemed to be looting a strange box repeatedly and we were suspicious of this, since we didn't know what it was he was doing or getting. We thought he was stealing treasure from us (newbie assumptions!). Now I know what it was, but at the time our view was very dismal of somebody getting treasure and not telling us what, since we're used to D&D rogues that will take from the group. Hindsight says he already KNEW all the clues and was just being a rogue; I think we would have been less irritated if we had known that. I think it's super easy to forget that new players don't know all the stuff for the classes. For a new person, someone getting tokens in a box quietly in a corner while we're busy screams 'he picked a lock and stole it!' if we don't know why.
- We didn't know he'd already done the adventure. So unfortunately we mostly ignored him since he just didn't say anything. I don't know if that was fun for him to just watch us. We didn't know we could ask for info or clues -- but maybe he was having fun just watching and didn't want to interact. I don't know. I think this is maybe a downside for him: either he interacts and spoils, or just doesn't get to interact. I'm not sure what the best balance is!

Zack wrote: ... We thought he was stealing treasure from us..
I'm not sure what the best balance is!

That wasn't me, never played rogue, but I got burned out on pickup groups last year. Trying to help noobs just enough without spoiling things is a strain. In my last run I failed, and realizing that I messed up someone else's time ruined it for me.

So, this year at least, my solution is to do zero pickup groups.

Just make your PUG group the first run you do of a run. I did that one year. Played Thursday Puzzle 9:01 PUG group. No one was on the forums. 5 had never played before, 2 had played once and the other two had played a few times.

It ended up being pretty awesome in my opinion. I could give advice about combat and TD in general (don't touch anything unless you want to risk taking damage or dying). But as far as the puzzles were concerned we were all in the same boat. We didn't get them all but it didn't matter. We did get the egg out of the tree and solved the drinking table without a single person dying. So pretty good for a bunch of randos and half a team of noobs. I admit they were equipped pretty well though.

I didn't play the puzzle side of that dungeon again till Sunday when I took coworkers and friends who were completely new to TD and Gen Con through on Hardcore. I was so tired by Sunday I don't think I provided much help to them either.