TOPIC: Change in Ghost Policy

Jeff, that seems like a reasonable solution. I guess you can monitor ticket sales to see if any further changes are needed going forward. I think it will help prevent excessive farming at the smaller cons by limiting the number of ghosts that can get treasure to 5 per group.

Thanks as always for having the TD Players backs.

So if I want to run with less than 10 players at gen con...it is not allowed anymore( even if I dont want the extra treasure)

lazlo_hollyfeld1985 wrote: So if I want to run with less than 10 players at gen con...it is not allowed anymore( even if I dont want the extra treasure)

If I read Jeff's most recent post correctly, the policy is the same for all cons, including Gen Con. As long as you've purchased 10 "hard" tickets you can run the dungeon solo if you like. You just can't collect treasure for more than 5 ghosts.

Dave wrote:

lazlo_hollyfeld1985 wrote: So if I want to run with less than 10 players at gen con...it is not allowed anymore( even if I dont want the extra treasure)

If I read Jeff's most recent post correctly, the policy is the same for all cons, including Gen Con. As long as you've purchased 10 "hard" tickets you can run the dungeon solo if you like. You just can't collect treasure for more than 5 ghosts.

That's how I read it.

If you want to say that GenCon staff are currently saying something different, you are not wrong. So I read this as Jeff committing to working this out so we can play as we always have. I just hope this doesn't wind up costing him revenue.

Jeff Martin wrote: Sorry for the confusion.

Regarding Ghosting...I am proposing that we make a simple change to the current Ghost policy on p. 54 of the PHB. It currently reads as below. My additions are in red. Obviously, we also need to change much below regarding how electronic tickets works once we have exact info on the ticketing system, but those will be changed later. Basically, Gen Con, Gamehole Con and Origins (in one month!) will have the same Ghosting policy.

Groups with Less Than 10 Players
In most circumstances, when the full complement of 10 players has not arrived before the official start time, we attempt to fill the group from players on the waiting list. However, there are exceptions.

Some groups prefer to play their adventure with less than 10 people but still maintain a “full” party. This is colloquially known as "ghosting." Ghosting is only permitted at Gen Con, Gamehole Con and Origins Game Fair—and is only permissible when all of these parameters are adhered to:

• All 10 hard tickets must be purchased by one or more players in the group. They may not pay for the runs with generic tickets. A hard ticket is a single ticket that specifies the exact date and time of the event the participant paid for.
  Note: The aforementioned rule for hard tickets only applies to groups deliberately running with less than 10 people. Players who fill in an incomplete party off the waiting list may pay with generic tickets.
• All 10 hard tickets must be turned in.
• All 10 wristbands must be put on members of that group. E.g., if a group chooses to run their adventure with eight people, two players would each wear two wristbands or one player would wear three wristbands. Determining which player(s) wear the extra wristband(s) is decided by the hard ticket holder(s).
• 10 bags of tokens will be distributed to the group, as determined by who is wearing the extra wristband(s). E.g., if a group chooses to run their adventure with eight people, two players would each receive two bags of tokens or one player would receive three bags of tokens. It’s up to the hard ticket holder(s) to decide how the extra bags are allotted.
• No matter how many wristbands a player is wearing, no person may play more than one character. So yes, someone could buy all 10 slots and solo the dungeon, but that person may only play a single character, not ten.
• Only Treasure-Enhancing (TE) or Synergistic tokens may be "equipped" on Ghost characters.
  Note: Ghost characters cannot duplicate a class currently being played by a real person. E.g., if the party contains a Bard, Cleric, Druid, Elf Wizard, and Wizard, no Ghost character can equip a Cabal item because none of the remaining classes are eligible to equip a Cabal item.
• Even though the maximum number of Ghost characters on a run is nine, no more than five Ghost characters may receive any Treasure Chip bonus. All Ghost characters can equip TEs if they wish, but only five Ghost characters will receive any Treasure Chips.
  Example 1: If one person buys out the slot of all 10 tickets, five of the ghost characters can have a number entered in the Total Treasure calls on the Party Card, but four will be left blank. The 10th character’s TE bonus will, of course, be that of the actual solo player. Synergistic TEs on non-eligible Ghosts count towards the synergy bonus on the eligible Ghosts. E.g., if someone solos the dungeon with 10 Charms of Avarice, only five Ghosts will get Treasure Chips, but the CoA bonus will be at its max.
  Example 2: The party consists of five real players and five Ghost players. In this case, all 10 characters can have a number entered into Total Treasure on the Party Card.
• 6th-level (or higher) players get one extra Treasure Chip for each wristband they’re wearing. Unlike treasure-enhancing tokens, level benefits count for all the extra slots that player paid for but were not filled with actual human beings. E.g., a 6th-level player soloing the dungeon would receive +10 Treasure Chips for being 6th-level, in addition to whatever other bonuses that person was entitled to.

Hi Jeff,

Are the completion tokens also limited to just fIve Ghost players?

Summary -

Bullet 4 says ghosts get a 10-pack.

Bullet 7 says only five ghosts get treasure bonuses, but the example says “any treasure at all.” So, not even the base 3. I’m guessing the examples are correct.

Bullet 8 had me confused a little. It feels like the ghosts are getting the longevity bonus, but I guess it’s the player getting the extra loot.

But I don’t see anything about completion tokens. Maybe they’re included in bullet 7? Maybe not.

after re reading the changes Jeff is making...it looks like we can have up to 5 ghosts (that get treasure) or you can still solo, but only get treasure for 5 ghosts.

We will need to have a plan or work around if Gen Con is making badges be scanned per ticket. If that is the case, my offer earlier stands. mine can be used for anyone while I am coaching.

I am going to bet their electronic system wont be advanced enough to tell that I am on 5 consecutive runs

Anyone still looking for a place to ask questions?

Adam Guay wrote: Anyone still looking for a place to ask questions?

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'Answering your questions'? Oh, man. Every TD regular who isnt putting kids to bed should be there.

Just some simple questions:
- How does one search for events based on ticket type?
- Since you can not search based on ticket type, can this data attribute be added to download files?
- Since this attribute is not going to be added to download files, can you provide a listing of events using electronic tickets?
- Based on not providing a list, what concrete evidence is there that electronic ticketing is being ironed out to be 100% validated and verified before GenCon 2018?
- Based on no evidence, what is plan B (backup plan)?
- Since no plan B, is GenCon willing to put its money where its mouth is?
- If this does not go at planned what do you think of the slogan "I went to Indy in August and all I got was GenConned"?

This was posted on the GenCon Forums earlier today.


So, I talked to Mike Boozer on the phone this morning about a refund, and expressed some of the same concerns which are being aired here.
I obviously don't speak for GenCon, and can't swear that I am quoting him perfectly on this, but what I took away from the phone call was this:
1) There WILL be a way to handle transferring e-tickets to a friend. It's not ready yet, but it's high on their priority list, and they are aware that True Dungeon players are eagerly waiting for it.
2) There WILL be a way for a person to use multiple tickets for themselves.
The example I gave was: “What if my friend (who uses a Scooter for mobility) has 2 tickets - because he wants twice as much space to move around in the cramped Dungeon - and he wants to use both tickets for himself? Would he be able to scan his badge twice, and TD would get credit for both tickets?” and Mike assured me that this was possible, so long as True Dungeon was willing to accept this, and that they would be given credit for both tickets. He even brought up the example where people will do challenge runs with fewer people than tickets, and that this could still work.
If Mike is reading these forums and wants to confirm this, I'd appreciate it! (Or please correct me if I came away with the wrong impression.)
I will say, though, that Mike did some excellent customer service and both managed to take care of my ticketing issue, AND reassured me that GenCon was aware of these issues and taking things very seriously. I'm now looking forward to August with a lot less apprehension than I had been. Both GenCon and True Dungeon take their player base seriously, and want this e-ticket experiment to be a success.
I wish GenCon all the best in their new venture, and hope that the potential bugs and corner-cases raised on these forums are addressed (and tested!) well before August.

Harlax wrote: This was posted on the GenCon Forums earlier today.


So, I talked to Mike Boozer on the phone this morning about a refund, and expressed some of the same concerns which are being aired here.
I obviously don't speak for GenCon, and can't swear that I am quoting him perfectly on this, but what I took away from the phone call was this:
1) There WILL be a way to handle transferring e-tickets to a friend. It's not ready yet, but it's high on their priority list, and they are aware that True Dungeon players are eagerly waiting for it.
2) There WILL be a way for a person to use multiple tickets for themselves.
The example I gave was: “What if my friend (who uses a Scooter for mobility) has 2 tickets - because he wants twice as much space to move around in the cramped Dungeon - and he wants to use both tickets for himself? Would he be able to scan his badge twice, and TD would get credit for both tickets?” and Mike assured me that this was possible, so long as True Dungeon was willing to accept this, and that they would be given credit for both tickets. He even brought up the example where people will do challenge runs with fewer people than tickets, and that this could still work.
If Mike is reading these forums and wants to confirm this, I'd appreciate it! (Or please correct me if I came away with the wrong impression.)
I will say, though, that Mike did some excellent customer service and both managed to take care of my ticketing issue, AND reassured me that GenCon was aware of these issues and taking things very seriously. I'm now looking forward to August with a lot less apprehension than I had been. Both GenCon and True Dungeon take their player base seriously, and want this e-ticket experiment to be a success.
I wish GenCon all the best in their new venture, and hope that the potential bugs and corner-cases raised on these forums are addressed (and tested!) well before August.

Thanks for sharing the update. It's positive news that they've listened and are working on it. But I don't think some of the apprehension will go away until we actually see it work. And I know it's a lesser concern, but I hope their system will allow me if I have back to back runs to check in for both at the same time.