TOPIC: Common Token Ideas

Matthew Hayward wrote:

archmage78 wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote: Earcuff of Synergy - Ear - All
+Max HP based on # of EoS worn in group:
1: +1
2-9: +2
10: +3

It would be a rare at the lowest. Ultra Rares give +4 hitpoints, and this gives Plus 3. Way too powerful for either a common or uncommon.

Full synergy UR gives +10, not +4 - compare apples to apples.

There are multiple commons that grant 1-3 HP (see list below)
There are multiple uncommons that grant 1-3 HP.
There are multiple rares that grant 3 HP, with no limitations.

Could you articulate, why you think it is way too powerful for a common or uncommon to grant +3 HP with substantial limitations (e.g. your party owns 10 and can be convinced to wear them)? Perhaps propose a version that you think is appropriate?

I simply can't see your reasoning given the existence of common tokens like:

tokendb.com/token/blighted-pants/ (+4 HP, +1 Fort, -1 Will for PuG players and anyone else who doesn't have an odd amount of CON boosting already)
tokendb.com/token/ioun-stone-norse-opal/ (+1 HP)
tokendb.com/token/raiders-shirt/ (+1 HP)
tokendb.com/token/ring-of-health/ (+1 HP)
tokendb.com/token/bogling-necklace/ (+2 HP)
tokendb.com/token/totem-amulet/ (+3 HP, when certain conditions are met)

Do you simply think synergy effects should never be printed at common?

Is the problem the slot? It could be moved to Ring of Neck?

Ah, try the Will's Dragonheart Ultra Rare. +4 hitpoints. So, yeah, apples to apples, an Ultra Rare that gives +4 Hit Points. Let's then add the Norse Opal Ioun Stone which gives +1 Hit Points as a common. These two tokens make it very clear that a common token giving 3 hitpoints is too powerful for a common. I actually really like your token ideas, but it is too powerful for a common.

archmage78 wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

archmage78 wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote: Earcuff of Synergy - Ear - All
+Max HP based on # of EoS worn in group:
1: +1
2-9: +2
10: +3

It would be a rare at the lowest. Ultra Rares give +4 hitpoints, and this gives Plus 3. Way too powerful for either a common or uncommon.

Full synergy UR gives +10, not +4 - compare apples to apples.

There are multiple commons that grant 1-3 HP (see list below)
There are multiple uncommons that grant 1-3 HP.
There are multiple rares that grant 3 HP, with no limitations.

Could you articulate, why you think it is way too powerful for a common or uncommon to grant +3 HP with substantial limitations (e.g. your party owns 10 and can be convinced to wear them)? Perhaps propose a version that you think is appropriate?

I simply can't see your reasoning given the existence of common tokens like:

tokendb.com/token/blighted-pants/ (+4 HP, +1 Fort, -1 Will for PuG players and anyone else who doesn't have an odd amount of CON boosting already)
tokendb.com/token/ioun-stone-norse-opal/ (+1 HP)
tokendb.com/token/raiders-shirt/ (+1 HP)
tokendb.com/token/ring-of-health/ (+1 HP)
tokendb.com/token/bogling-necklace/ (+2 HP)
tokendb.com/token/totem-amulet/ (+3 HP, when certain conditions are met)

Do you simply think synergy effects should never be printed at common?

Is the problem the slot? It could be moved to Ring of Neck?

Ah, try the Will's Dragonheart Ultra Rare. +4 hitpoints. So, yeah, apples to apples, an Ultra Rare that gives +4 Hit Points. Let's then add the Norse Opal Ioun Stone which gives +1 Hit Points as a common. These two tokens make it very clear that a common token giving 3 hitpoints is too powerful for a common. I actually really like your token ideas, but it is too powerful for a common.

Will's Dragonheart isn't a synergy token, though, and we do have a +3 hp common in the current set (totem amulet). The real comparison is 10 people wearing a Charm of Synergy, which is 10HP. Given that comparison, a common feels right at 3 hp if you can get the whole party to wear them. What it will really be, though, is you and your buddy wearing them and scoring the 2-9 bonus of +2 hp, which is more or less a earcuff of vitality or charm of health. I would support moving this token from ear to charm slot, though, because we need more non situational charms at rare and below.

{Necklace} of Asymmetry
If there are 1,3,5,7,9 total in the party +2 HP.
If there are 2,4,6,8,10 total in the party +1HP.

Just trying something different.

jedibcg wrote: {Necklace} of Asymmetry
If there are 1,3,5,7,9 total in the party +2 HP.
If there are 2,4,6,8,10 total in the party +1HP.

Just trying something different.

Make it an ioun ston, or +4 or +2 HP bonus, since we already have +2 and +3 HP common neck slot items.

Endgame wrote:

archmage78 wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

archmage78 wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote: Earcuff of Synergy - Ear - All
+Max HP based on # of EoS worn in group:
1: +1
2-9: +2
10: +3

It would be a rare at the lowest. Ultra Rares give +4 hitpoints, and this gives Plus 3. Way too powerful for either a common or uncommon.

Full synergy UR gives +10, not +4 - compare apples to apples.

There are multiple commons that grant 1-3 HP (see list below)
There are multiple uncommons that grant 1-3 HP.
There are multiple rares that grant 3 HP, with no limitations.

Could you articulate, why you think it is way too powerful for a common or uncommon to grant +3 HP with substantial limitations (e.g. your party owns 10 and can be convinced to wear them)? Perhaps propose a version that you think is appropriate?

I simply can't see your reasoning given the existence of common tokens like:

tokendb.com/token/blighted-pants/ (+4 HP, +1 Fort, -1 Will for PuG players and anyone else who doesn't have an odd amount of CON boosting already)
tokendb.com/token/ioun-stone-norse-opal/ (+1 HP)
tokendb.com/token/raiders-shirt/ (+1 HP)
tokendb.com/token/ring-of-health/ (+1 HP)
tokendb.com/token/bogling-necklace/ (+2 HP)
tokendb.com/token/totem-amulet/ (+3 HP, when certain conditions are met)

Do you simply think synergy effects should never be printed at common?

Is the problem the slot? It could be moved to Ring of Neck?

Ah, try the Will's Dragonheart Ultra Rare. +4 hitpoints. So, yeah, apples to apples, an Ultra Rare that gives +4 Hit Points. Let's then add the Norse Opal Ioun Stone which gives +1 Hit Points as a common. These two tokens make it very clear that a common token giving 3 hitpoints is too powerful for a common. I actually really like your token ideas, but it is too powerful for a common.

Will's Dragonheart isn't a synergy token, though, and we do have a +3 hp common in the current set (totem amulet). The real comparison is 10 people wearing a Charm of Synergy, which is 10HP. Given that comparison, a common feels right at 3 hp if you can get the whole party to wear them. What it will really be, though, is you and your buddy wearing them and scoring the 2-9 bonus of +2 hp, which is more or less a earcuff of vitality or charm of health. I would support moving this token from ear to charm slot, though, because we need more non situational charms at rare and below.

The earcuff of vitality is a rare and the charm of health is a relic........not even remotely in the same discussion as a common. Perhaps an Uncommon but I still maintain not a common. I suppose that you could argue that the negative is needing multiple people to wear them to get HP but if we are going that route, it should be 1-3 1 HP 4-8 2 HP and 9-10 3 HP

archmage78 wrote:

Endgame wrote:

archmage78 wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

archmage78 wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote: Earcuff of Synergy - Ear - All
+Max HP based on # of EoS worn in group:
1: +1
2-9: +2
10: +3

It would be a rare at the lowest. Ultra Rares give +4 hitpoints, and this gives Plus 3. Way too powerful for either a common or uncommon.

Full synergy UR gives +10, not +4 - compare apples to apples.

There are multiple commons that grant 1-3 HP (see list below)
There are multiple uncommons that grant 1-3 HP.
There are multiple rares that grant 3 HP, with no limitations.

Could you articulate, why you think it is way too powerful for a common or uncommon to grant +3 HP with substantial limitations (e.g. your party owns 10 and can be convinced to wear them)? Perhaps propose a version that you think is appropriate?

I simply can't see your reasoning given the existence of common tokens like:

tokendb.com/token/blighted-pants/ (+4 HP, +1 Fort, -1 Will for PuG players and anyone else who doesn't have an odd amount of CON boosting already)
tokendb.com/token/ioun-stone-norse-opal/ (+1 HP)
tokendb.com/token/raiders-shirt/ (+1 HP)
tokendb.com/token/ring-of-health/ (+1 HP)
tokendb.com/token/bogling-necklace/ (+2 HP)
tokendb.com/token/totem-amulet/ (+3 HP, when certain conditions are met)

Do you simply think synergy effects should never be printed at common?

Is the problem the slot? It could be moved to Ring of Neck?

Ah, try the Will's Dragonheart Ultra Rare. +4 hitpoints. So, yeah, apples to apples, an Ultra Rare that gives +4 Hit Points. Let's then add the Norse Opal Ioun Stone which gives +1 Hit Points as a common. These two tokens make it very clear that a common token giving 3 hitpoints is too powerful for a common. I actually really like your token ideas, but it is too powerful for a common.

Will's Dragonheart isn't a synergy token, though, and we do have a +3 hp common in the current set (totem amulet). The real comparison is 10 people wearing a Charm of Synergy, which is 10HP. Given that comparison, a common feels right at 3 hp if you can get the whole party to wear them. What it will really be, though, is you and your buddy wearing them and scoring the 2-9 bonus of +2 hp, which is more or less a earcuff of vitality or charm of health. I would support moving this token from ear to charm slot, though, because we need more non situational charms at rare and below.

The earcuff of vitality is a rare and the charm of health is a relic........not even remotely in the same discussion as a common. Perhaps an Uncommon but I still maintain not a common. I suppose that you could argue that the negative is needing multiple people to wear them to get HP but if we are going that route, it should be 1-3 1 HP 4-8 2 HP and 9-10 3 HP

Charm of health is not a relic. It's a 3* enhanced transmute that used 2 Commons and 50 gp
tokendb.com/token/charm-of-health/

This would be the same idea - 2 commons gets you 2 hp, but instead of 50 gp, you have to find someone else to wear one.

I'm just going to throw out there that we have been trying to raise the floor on common quality for a few years, hp are a low risk stat in that they are player tracked anyway (and probably tracked wrong in a lot of first time runs anyway), GPS seem to be the number one request by new players on the forms this year looking to up their survivability, and synergy is s fun team building exercise.

Granted a synergy common would be a powerful common, but charm of synergy is a powerful effect for its rarity too.

Medallion of Midgard - Neck - All
+1 CON

Matthew Hayward wrote: Medallion of Midgard - Neck - All
+1 CON

I like this, though it does feel like power creep at common. We currently have neck slots that are +2 HP, or +3 HP with restrictions.
This would (likely) be +4 HP and + 1 fort save. Should it be uncommon? Or have some restriction?

Wade Schwendemann wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote: Medallion of Midgard - Neck - All
+1 CON

I like this, though it does feel like power creep at common. We currently have neck slots that are +2 HP, or +3 HP with restrictions.
This would (likely) be +4 HP and + 1 fort save. Should it be uncommon? Or have some restriction?

Maybe +1 con -1 saves

Wade Schwendemann wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote: Medallion of Midgard - Neck - All
+1 CON

I like this, though it does feel like power creep at common. We currently have neck slots that are +2 HP, or +3 HP with restrictions.
This would (likely) be +4 HP and + 1 fort save. Should it be uncommon? Or have some restriction?

There is a +1 CON, -1 Will saves common pants already.

I think neck slot is more powerful than pants slot.

Wayne Rhodes wrote:

Wade Schwendemann wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote: Medallion of Midgard - Neck - All
+1 CON

I like this, though it does feel like power creep at common. We currently have neck slots that are +2 HP, or +3 HP with restrictions.
This would (likely) be +4 HP and + 1 fort save. Should it be uncommon? Or have some restriction?

Maybe +1 con -1 saves

Strictly worse than common Blighted Pants ( tokendb.com/token/blighted-pants/ ) in the neck slot?