TOPIC: FINAL Transmute Images

MasterED wrote:

BeLinda Mathie wrote:

Kirk Bauer wrote: I'm happy with all of this. Let's make sure the TokenDB pages get updated for Viper Strike Set and Nightshade's Sneaky Necklace to be clear how they interact (sounds like with both a slide of 17-20 counts as a critical which doubles the sneak attack bonus damage). How does it interact with Assassin's Crossbow? Is the bonus damage tripled on a slide of 17+?

If this is correct, does it apply to Nightshade's Sneaky Necklace and Nightshade's +2 Short Sword as well? (Or the Necklace of the Sneak and Nightshade's +2 Short Sword with a slide of 19-20?) The Token DB entry for Nightshade's +2 Short Sword conditions the doubled sneak attack bonus on sliding "a critical hit," not a 20:

Note: If a rogue making a sneak attack scores a critical hit while wielding Nightshade’s +2 Short Sword, all damage is doubled, including the sneak attack bonus. When using most other weapons, sneak attack damage is not doubled on a crit.

My interpretation is that both Nightshade and Viper’s double the sneak attack damage bonus from 15 (fourth level) to 30 and 20 (fifth level) to 40 if there is a critical (enhanced range applying).

Both weapons are melee and the Viper Set specifically says melee weapon so it would not apply with Assassin’s Crossbow.

And remember it is just the Rogue’s sneak attacks that are in an enhanced critical range not their normal attacks.

Ed

The viper strike set also requires an attack with a viper strike weapon, correct?

Wade Schwendemann wrote:

MasterED wrote:

BeLinda Mathie wrote:

Kirk Bauer wrote: I'm happy with all of this. Let's make sure the TokenDB pages get updated for Viper Strike Set and Nightshade's Sneaky Necklace to be clear how they interact (sounds like with both a slide of 17-20 counts as a critical which doubles the sneak attack bonus damage). How does it interact with Assassin's Crossbow? Is the bonus damage tripled on a slide of 17+?

If this is correct, does it apply to Nightshade's Sneaky Necklace and Nightshade's +2 Short Sword as well? (Or the Necklace of the Sneak and Nightshade's +2 Short Sword with a slide of 19-20?) The Token DB entry for Nightshade's +2 Short Sword conditions the doubled sneak attack bonus on sliding "a critical hit," not a 20:

Note: If a rogue making a sneak attack scores a critical hit while wielding Nightshade’s +2 Short Sword, all damage is doubled, including the sneak attack bonus. When using most other weapons, sneak attack damage is not doubled on a crit.

My interpretation is that both Nightshade and Viper’s double the sneak attack damage bonus from 15 (fourth level) to 30 and 20 (fifth level) to 40 if there is a critical (enhanced range applying).

Both weapons are melee and the Viper Set specifically says melee weapon so it would not apply with Assassin’s Crossbow.

And remember it is just the Rogue’s sneak attacks that are in an enhanced critical range not their normal attacks.

Ed

The viper strike set also requires an attack with a viper strike weapon, correct?

Not for the +2 hit. “Only” for the crit bonus

tokendb.com/token/2-viper-strike-fang/

Brad Mortensen wrote:

Wade Schwendemann wrote:

MasterED wrote:

BeLinda Mathie wrote:

Kirk Bauer wrote: I'm happy with all of this. Let's make sure the TokenDB pages get updated for Viper Strike Set and Nightshade's Sneaky Necklace to be clear how they interact (sounds like with both a slide of 17-20 counts as a critical which doubles the sneak attack bonus damage). How does it interact with Assassin's Crossbow? Is the bonus damage tripled on a slide of 17+?

If this is correct, does it apply to Nightshade's Sneaky Necklace and Nightshade's +2 Short Sword as well? (Or the Necklace of the Sneak and Nightshade's +2 Short Sword with a slide of 19-20?) The Token DB entry for Nightshade's +2 Short Sword conditions the doubled sneak attack bonus on sliding "a critical hit," not a 20:

Note: If a rogue making a sneak attack scores a critical hit while wielding Nightshade’s +2 Short Sword, all damage is doubled, including the sneak attack bonus. When using most other weapons, sneak attack damage is not doubled on a crit.

My interpretation is that both Nightshade and Viper’s double the sneak attack damage bonus from 15 (fourth level) to 30 and 20 (fifth level) to 40 if there is a critical (enhanced range applying).

Both weapons are melee and the Viper Set specifically says melee weapon so it would not apply with Assassin’s Crossbow.

And remember it is just the Rogue’s sneak attacks that are in an enhanced critical range not their normal attacks.

Ed

The viper strike set also requires an attack with a viper strike weapon, correct?

Not for the +2 hit. “Only” for the crit bonus

tokendb.com/token/2-viper-strike-fang/

Thanks.

So, a 5th rogue wielding nightshade's +2 short sword with viper strike pants, belt, and shirt, wearing the legendary necklace and bracers of guided strike slides a 17 on a sneak attack, which is a hit. The sword icon faces the damage dot.

How much damage?

Wade Schwendemann wrote: So, a 5th rogue wielding nightshade's +2 short sword with viper strike pants, belt, and shirt, wearing the legendary necklace and bracers of guided strike slides a 17 on a sneak attack, which is a hit. The sword icon faces the damage dot.

How much damage?

Viper Strike Set bonus damage doesn't apply because a Viper Strike weapon wasn't used.

So in your scenario, 20 points (sneak attack bonus) plus 10 points (dagger symbol) plus player STR bonus. Add all of that together and then double it (because of the Nightshade's +2 Short Sword effect).

Kirk Bauer wrote:

Wade Schwendemann wrote: So, a 5th rogue wielding nightshade's +2 short sword with viper strike pants, belt, and shirt, wearing the legendary necklace and bracers of guided strike slides a 17 on a sneak attack, which is a hit. The sword icon faces the damage dot.

How much damage?

Viper Strike Set bonus damage doesn't apply because a Viper Strike weapon wasn't used.

So in your scenario, 20 points (sneak attack bonus) plus 10 points (dagger symbol) plus player STR bonus. Add all of that together and then double it (because of the Nightshade's +2 Short Sword effect).

I concur with a minor clarification. ...with player melee damage bonus (which includes STR)

Ed

MasterED wrote:

Kirk Bauer wrote:

Wade Schwendemann wrote: So, a 5th rogue wielding nightshade's +2 short sword with viper strike pants, belt, and shirt, wearing the legendary necklace and bracers of guided strike slides a 17 on a sneak attack, which is a hit. The sword icon faces the damage dot.

How much damage?

Viper Strike Set bonus damage doesn't apply because a Viper Strike weapon wasn't used.

So in your scenario, 20 points (sneak attack bonus) plus 10 points (dagger symbol) plus player STR bonus. Add all of that together and then double it (because of the Nightshade's +2 Short Sword effect).

I concur with a minor clarification. ...with player melee damage bonus (which includes STR)

Ed

Sorry, yes, that is what I meant to say Whatever is in the box on the party card.

Beertram wrote: Maybe this thought came too late, but if the mental abilities are going to be more relevant in the future, perhaps the kilt should have been "+5 HP & choose at the start +4 to any one ability score".

I'm sure most of us have been accused of thinking from between their legs...

This was mentioned a few times by different people - so it was deliberate to not do that.

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Beertram wrote: Maybe this thought came too late, but if the mental abilities are going to be more relevant in the future, perhaps the kilt should have been "+5 HP & choose at the start +4 to any one ability score".

I'm sure most of us have been accused of thinking from between their legs...

This was mentioned a few times by different people - so it was deliberate to not do that.

Yes, I'm sure it was. With changes coming next year it is best NOT to print any new tokens that boost these stats, in my opinion. It just increases the design constraints and/or the possibility of a token requiring an errata.

Any slot boosting should be easily discussed. Now if there are other abilities or new tokens to fill those slots there will be lots of discussions about those.

Kirk Bauer wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Beertram wrote: Maybe this thought came too late, but if the mental abilities are going to be more relevant in the future, perhaps the kilt should have been "+5 HP & choose at the start +4 to any one ability score".

I'm sure most of us have been accused of thinking from between their legs...

This was mentioned a few times by different people - so it was deliberate to not do that.

Yes, I'm sure it was. With changes coming next year it is best NOT to print any new tokens that boost these stats, in my opinion. It just increases the design constraints and/or the possibility of a token requiring an errata.

I wouldn't be at all surprised if we have a multi-year transmute boosting INT, WIS, and/or CHAR starting next year.

Harlax wrote:

Fiddy wrote:

Beertram wrote: Maybe this thought came too late, but if the mental stats are going to be more relevant in the future, perhaps the kilt should have been "+5 HP & choose at the start +4 to any one stat".

Disagree. Strongly. Let's please not add more boosts to stats before we know what impact it will have.

We already have the Charm of Enlightenment (+8 WIS), Moonhide Robe (+3 INT) and Starhide Robe (+5 INT).

Challenges enough without adding to them.

I can see the charm of enlightenment being reprinted to let’s say +4 will and the old print being errataed, if the game mechanics are thrown off by it in 2020. Just like the cloak of shadow skin and lenses of divine sight ultrarare tokens for this year. It would be more challenging to replace the charm of enlightenment as the cloak of shadow skin has less circulation. (being the difference in rarity)

Kakitahan wrote:

Harlax wrote:

Fiddy wrote:

Beertram wrote: Maybe this thought came too late, but if the mental stats are going to be more relevant in the future, perhaps the kilt should have been "+5 HP & choose at the start +4 to any one stat".

Disagree. Strongly. Let's please not add more boosts to stats before we know what impact it will have.

We already have the Charm of Enlightenment (+8 WIS), Moonhide Robe (+3 INT) and Starhide Robe (+5 INT).

Challenges enough without adding to them.

I can see the charm of enlightenment being reprinted to let’s say +4 will and the old print being errataed, if the game mechanics are thrown off by it in 2020. Just like the cloak of shadow skin and lenses of divine sight ultrarare tokens for this year. It would be more challenging to replace the charm of enlightenment as the cloak of shadow skin has less circulation. (being the difference in rarity)

I really hope they don’t nerf Charm of Enlightenment. I just use it for the will save boost since it is such a hard save to boost. There are plenty of ways to boost fort and reflex saves by just upping your Con or Dex. And since I typically play paladin I just want to boost that save, nothing extra special.