TOPIC: Relic tokens that are BIS other than Ring of Greater Focus?

jedibcg wrote:

Fred K wrote: The +3 throwing hammer is often best in slot for ranged 1 hand weapon since the +5 has a higher dex requirement. I have a number of builds that get to 18 dex but not 20 depending on the class.

Fred

That is an interesting point.

That is, I hadn't thought of that one.

Arcanist Kolixela wrote:

jedibcg wrote:

Fred K wrote: The +3 throwing hammer is often best in slot for ranged 1 hand weapon since the +5 has a higher dex requirement. I have a number of builds that get to 18 dex but not 20 depending on the class.

Fred

That is an interesting point.

That is, I hadn't thought of that one.

Of course you also have to remember that the Relic can only be thrown once per combat since it isn't Returning.

Fiddy wrote:

Arcanist Kolixela wrote:

jedibcg wrote:

Fred K wrote: The +3 throwing hammer is often best in slot for ranged 1 hand weapon since the +5 has a higher dex requirement. I have a number of builds that get to 18 dex but not 20 depending on the class.

Fred

That is an interesting point.

That is, I hadn't thought of that one.

Of course you also have to remember that the Relic can only be thrown once per combat since it isn't Returning.

Understood - typically, if you have a melee heavy character, you only need ranged for 1 or 2 rounds before you resolve why you can't attack in melee again.

Fred

It is hypothetical situation so having a stack of them is possible.

jedibcg wrote: It is hypothetical situation so having a stack of them is possible.

Less of a Hypothetical, more questioning what Relic tokens that have a Legendary equivalent exist where keeping the relic form is desired.

The Legendary ring
The Legendary cloak
The Legendary hammer

I don't count the Charm of Awakened Synergy as it's not a component of a legendary token.

Cloak is good for everyone
Ring is good for healers and casters
Hammer Relic is for weapon builds without enough DEX for the Legendary.


Any others that should be counted here?

Arcanist Kolixela wrote:

jedibcg wrote: It is hypothetical situation so having a stack of them is possible.

Less of a Hypothetical, more questioning what Relic tokens that have a Legendary equivalent exist where keeping the relic form is desired.

The Legendary ring
The Legendary cloak
The Legendary hammer

I don't count the Charm of Awakened Synergy as it's not a component of a legendary token.

Cloak is good for everyone
Ring is good for healers and casters
Hammer Relic is for weapon builds without enough DEX for the Legendary.


Any others that should be counted here?

If you're using that logic for the Hammer, then should the same logic apply to the Relic Bow?

Fiddy wrote:

Arcanist Kolixela wrote:

jedibcg wrote: It is hypothetical situation so having a stack of them is possible.

Less of a Hypothetical, more questioning what Relic tokens that have a Legendary equivalent exist where keeping the relic form is desired.

The Legendary ring
The Legendary cloak
The Legendary hammer

I don't count the Charm of Awakened Synergy as it's not a component of a legendary token.

Cloak is good for everyone
Ring is good for healers and casters
Hammer Relic is for weapon builds without enough DEX for the Legendary.


Any others that should be counted here?

If you're using that logic for the Hammer, then should the same logic apply to the Relic Bow?

That makes sense on the bow as well but in more limited cases. The relic bow is only usable by 5 classes whereas the hammer is usable by all classes. I also tend to see the hammer being used more - probably because those tend to be strength builds but there is definitely application for the bow as well.

Fred

Arcanist Kolixela wrote:
Less of a Hypothetical, more questioning what Relic tokens that have a Legendary equivalent exist where keeping the relic form is desired.

Any others that should be counted here?

That didn't seem what you were originally asking but okay. I still say based on that, you have to consider the AC ring in an AC build (since you never defined what BiS is). If I want to build a Wall of a Paladin then the legendary and relic ring to max out AC and Amulet of Guarding so I can guard more.

As an edge case which is unlikely to ever matter, the relic Rogue necklace is twice per game while the legendary version is once per combat. So if you are using a main weapon like Thor's Throwing Hammer which cannot benefit from the expanded crit range on the legendary necklace then there may be an argument for using the relic instead since it gives you the option of performing three Sneak Attacks in the same combat against a particularly difficult enemy (although you'd probably still want to space them across multiple combats with the legendary instead).

It's also worth mentioning that the wording on the necklace is "SA a 2nd time" and not "SA an additional time", which may have been to save space but means that there's some room for interpretation on whether you can actually do three in the same combat.... does anyone know if there has ever been a ruling on whether you can use both of the bonus Sneak Attacks against the same enemy?

The relic rogue item has a limit of 2 sneak attacks on the same monster.The language appears to limit the sneaks to just the same monster (i.e. it doesn't explicitly say you could do attacks additional sneak attacks against a separate monster).

Twice per game, the wearer may attempt a sneak attack the same monster twice in the same room–neither instance requires a prep round. “Twice per game” refers to the 2nd sneak attack.

There is an item that allows a 2nd sneak attack against another monster other than the first target. To my knowledge only those shoes and the legendary would allow sneak attacks against two separate targets in the same room. The language seems pretty clear that the most sneak attacks on a single target would be two.

Fred

If that's how it works in TD then in that case I guess you would never run the relic over the legendary, thanks. I've previously played different TCGs which would rule that type of wording in both ways which is why I was unsure.

jedibcg wrote:

Arcanist Kolixela wrote:
Less of a Hypothetical, more questioning what Relic tokens that have a Legendary equivalent exist where keeping the relic form is desired.

Any others that should be counted here?

That didn't seem what you were originally asking but okay. I still say based on that, you have to consider the AC ring in an AC build (since you never defined what BiS is). If I want to build a Wall of a Paladin then the legendary and relic ring to max out AC and Amulet of Guarding so I can guard more.

Ok valid. They'd be included