TOPIC: Winter Soldier and Agents of SHIELD

So, saw Captain America: Winter Soldier today. Not quite as good as the hype, but still excellent.

And I've been watching Marvel's Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. And it just hit me, all the potential implications for AoS.

Spoilers ahead.
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Not Kidding...
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Last Chance...
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Okay, SHIELD, Hydra, and the Clairvoyant. Even if the Clairvoyant isn't really psychic, if he is so smart and so deep in SHIELD's files, could he have an inkling about Hydra? Maybe he's actually a good(ish) guy? Or maybe he is part of Hydra? Or is he just a different villain? Sitwell is Hydra, and he is still with SHIELD in Winter Soldier, so he either is not with the Clairvoyant or he manages to keep it on the down low.

And what does the ending of Winter Soldier mean for AoS? For that matter, is anyone on the team Hydra? Mei seems like the obvious choice, but maybe too obvious. Right now I would say anyone but AC and Skye are suspect.

Too much to think about, Tuesday can't come fast enough.

Wasn't expecting a speculation thread here.

First there's the matter of the Clairvoyant. Based on all the inferences that have appeared in the show I am confidant that it is Agent Hand. As Sitwell and Hand were teamed up for the manhunt, when both were pulled from it there was an indication that Hand is also Hydra but I’d have to say the odds of that are no better than 60/40.
Based on the timing of the show I’d say that the end of the season will roughly coincide with the… I want to say collapse of S.H.I.E.L.D. but that does’t really sound right; so that isn’t going to be something we’ll see a resolution about until season two.
As for secret Hydra members, you’re right Mei is likely the red herring. While she has been keeping tabs on Coulson her report indicated that she had at least some knowledge about the true nature of T.A.H.I.T.I. Given the security measures in place about that, the only one that could have told her anything about that would be Fury; thus she is reporting to him. This is further supported by the kill order Hand gave regarding everyone on the bus. If Mei(or anyone else on the bus) were working for the Clairvoyant/Hydra then she(they) would likely have been mentioned along with Coulson as an exemption or it would have been a general capture order. The ones I have suspicions about are Agents Triplett and Garrett.
Now as for the end of Winter Soldier in addition to the collapse of S.H.I.E.L.D. there’s another mater that is going to significantly impact the group; the releasing of the S.H.I.E.L.D. database onto the net. Anyone care to put any wagers on how Skye will react when she finds out Coulson was keeping things secret about her parents? Or how the information that Coulson is still alive is going to be taken by the Avengers?

Now having said all that there is one thing to keep in mind; this is a Joss Whedon show. The man is infamous for screwing with the audience(I’m looking at you Cheese Guy). Expecting the curve ball is always a safe bet.

Saw it Thursday night during the pre-release.

I know the original poster has a differing opinion saying it wasn't as good as the hype, but I say Cap 2 was better than awesome and was better than the Avengers. And, that is saying something because I feel the Avengers is one of the best movies ever made in the past 30+ years.

As for speculation(s):

Mei reports directly to Nick. Since Fury has a soft spot for Coulson, he would want someone right next to him at all times to make sure his "healing process" is going fine and there are no mental or physical side effects of the Kree blood transfusion.

Yes, Kree. That's the only obvious choice of the blue alien in the cryo-tube. Atlanteans are out because they would fall under the Fox Studios copyrights because the Atlanteans/Namor would fall under X-Men and the Fantastic Four. Plus! GotG is coming out this year and that links the Guardians even further to the Avengers/S.H.I.E.L.D. besides the obvious tie-in with Thanos.

William Koogler wrote: Or how the information that Coulson is still alive is going to be taken by the Avengers?

I'm guessing this is going to be a big anti-climax. AC will walk in the room, expecting some big blow up, and everyone will just be like "Hi Phil" or "Why are you late?". Except maybe Hawkeye, and then Hawk will get all angry and the others will explain how they knew.

Cap: In Winter Soldier, Cap is shown to have level 8 clearance (in the elevator). In AoS ep 1, AC tells Ward the reason the Avengers don't know is they don't have level 8 clearance, but now he (Ward) does. If Cap is L8, he could know.

Widow: Widow's clearance is unclear, but L8 or even L9 is likely. And Fury might have told her just so she doesn't get surprised if she runs into AC on a mission.

Thor: Sif might have promised not to tell Thor, but Heimdall was almost certainly watching and he did not.

Stark: Tony has already proven willing and able to hack into SHIELD's computers.

Banner: Since he is working with/for Tony, Tony could have told him.

Hawk-eye: Either he'll know by clearance, or he won't know for the exposition and humor of the scene.

Ro-gan wrote: Atlanteans are out because they would fall under the Fox Studios copyrights because the Atlanteans/Namor would fall under X-Men and the Fantastic Four. [/color]

Namor predates the X-Men and the FF, and his mutant status was a retcon. And given the whole Quicksilver/Scarlet Witch thing, the borderline characters appear to be on a first come, first serve basis.

William Koogler wrote: Anyone care to put any wagers on how Skye will react when she finds out Coulson was keeping things secret about her parents?

Coulson has been pretty open with Skye about everything he knows. He told her that she was the object of unknown origin and the whole story about the agents that were trying to save her and what happened to them. If shield knows more there is no evidence that Coulson had any more info. He was trying to help Skye find more.

Xavon wrote: Sitwell is Hydra, and he is still with SHIELD in Winter Soldier, so he either is not with the Clairvoyant or he manages to keep it on the down low.

Interesting. You seem to be operating on a very different base timing assumption than I was. Opens some new possibilities to think about.

My thoughts are that Sitwell reporting back to The Triskellion during the last Agents episode was immediately followed by him taking Zola's algorithm to the Lamerian Star.

At this point I am guessing that the clairvoyant is Hydra and may not even be a single person but just a Hydra operation. I'm guessing the end of the last Agents episode occurs at roughly the same time as the elevator scene in Winter Soldier.

What is going to happen to Coulson's team with the fall of SHIELD is an interesting question, but the more important question is what is going to happen to the Fridge and the Sandbox. As well as all the other SHIELD storage/research facilities. SHIELD was caretaker of a lot of things that should probably stay out of the general public.

Xavon wrote:

Ro-gan wrote: Atlanteans are out because they would fall under the Fox Studios copyrights because the Atlanteans/Namor would fall under X-Men and the Fantastic Four. [/color]

Namor predates the X-Men and the FF, and his mutant status was a retcon. And given the whole Quicksilver/Scarlet Witch thing, the borderline characters appear to be on a first come, first serve basis.

Marvel clarified recently that the Namor movie rights still reside at Universal. I'm not sure how much longer Universal has to make a Namor movie before the rights transfer back to Marvel. Joe Quesada was surprised they hadn't transferred already, he (and most people) thought they had.

I thought Captain America 2 more than lived up to the hype, and I'm already looking forward to Captain America 3

Cormroc wrote:

Xavon wrote: Sitwell is Hydra, and he is still with SHIELD in Winter Soldier, so he either is not with the Clairvoyant or he manages to keep it on the down low.

Interesting. You seem to be operating on a very different base timing assumption than I was. Opens some new possibilities to think about.

My thoughts are that Sitwell reporting back to The Triskellion during the last Agents episode was immediately followed by him taking Zola's algorithm to the Lamerian Star. I'm guessing the end of the last Agents episode occurs at roughly the same time as the elevator scene in Winter Soldier.

I doubt that I am expecting Winter Soldier takes place weeks, if not months after the last AoS episode. Because AoS can't spoil Winter Soldier until it has been in theaters for at least a few weeks or months, so as not to cut into the gross. With your timeline, they would either have to spoil it, or have the AoS timeline drag out so that the few days Winter Soldier covers last until the end of the AoS season.

At this point I am guessing that the clairvoyant is Hydra and may not even be a single person but just a Hydra operation.

Could be. But the Clairvoyant is also pretty set on damaging SHIELD, which I doubt Hydra would do at this point. Unless multiple heads of the beast are working at odds with each other.

What is going to happen to Coulson's team with the fall of SHIELD is an interesting question, but the more important question is what is going to happen to the Fridge and the Sandbox. As well as all the other SHIELD storage/research facilities. SHIELD was caretaker of a lot of things that should probably stay out of the general public.

Good question. Hopefully the government will keep them operating until SHIELD is re-established.

Mike Steele wrote: I thought Captain America 2 more than lived up to the hype, and I'm already looking forward to Captain America 3

I definitely enjoyed it, but I kept hearing "Better then The Avengers" over and over, and for me that just wasn't true. I wish they would have thrown in at least a line or two about Hawkeye, to justify why another major SHIELD operative was not around for these momentous events. And frankly I thought that for being the title character, Winter Soldier did not get enough screen time or focus.

Xavon wrote:

Mike Steele wrote: I thought Captain America 2 more than lived up to the hype, and I'm already looking forward to Captain America 3

I definitely enjoyed it, but I kept hearing "Better then The Avengers" over and over, and for me that just wasn't true. I wish they would have thrown in at least a line or two about Hawkeye, to justify why another major SHIELD operative was not around for these momentous events. And frankly I thought that for being the title character, Winter Soldier did not get enough screen time or focus.

I wouldn't call it better than the Avengers, I thought it was a very different movie, but I thought it was one of the best Marvel has done so far, and one of the best Super-hero movies so far. I'm fine with Hawkeye not being in it, there were plenty of characters already, any more and it might have felt crowded.

Regarding the fallout on Agents of Shield, I found this on ComicBookResources.Com

Coulson's team will go from being part of a worldwide organization to being "a ragtag bunch scraping things together," executive producer Jed Whedon told USA Today.

The article also says that many of the threats that have been revealed on the show thus far will tie back to HYDRA, something they couldn't do before "The Winter Soldier" hit theaters for fear of spoiling it. They also tease a major betrayal, and that "what's left of Coulson's team is forced to deal on their own with the dismantling of their whole world as well as the new HYDRA threat."

I'm pretty sure "Aaron" from the Apple Store was Aaron Stack.

Right, Mike?

And my wife caught that Black Widow was wearing an arrow shaped pendant on her necklace. So, there's a possible Hawkeye reference right there.