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TOPIC: DMs Going off Script?

DMs Going off Script? 2 years 1 month ago #1

I'm pretty confident that in the Shambling mound room the DM was extending combat until the horn blew on Saturday.

In 3 trips to the room combat went till the horn blew at which point they announced that the monster was killed - in one case I think we got 5 or maybe even 6 rounds of combat in with a legendary geared party.

Another player on one of my runs mentioned that when they DM they sometimes do the same thing (extend combat till the end if players inflict lethal monster damage early).

I appreciate the desire to make the dungeon more engaging, but I think this is short sighted.

It erodes trust in DMs and the system if players don't understand why the DM is doing it: some players will interpret this as "the DM is cheating and trying to kill players1!111!'.

It's also not great for Wizards or people who are using ammo as it causes them to burn more of their limited attack resources than are necessary, reducing their effectiveness later in the dungeon.

If DMs are empowered to play this sort of thing by ear, then fine.

If not perhaps this should be a point of emphasis in next years training: "You may think you are doing players a favor, but this can backfire in unexpected ways - do not extend combat even if it seems the combat was too easy."

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Last edit: by Matthew Hayward.

DMs Going off Script? 2 years 1 month ago #2

Matthew Hayward wrote: I'm pretty confident that in the Shambling mound room the DM was extending combat until the horn blew on Saturday.

In 3 trips to the room combat went till the horn blew at which point they announced that the monster was killed - in one case I think we got 5 or maybe even 6 rounds of combat in with a legendary geared party.

Another player on one of my runs mentioned that when they DM they sometimes do the same thing (extend combat till the end if players inflict lethal monster damage early).

I appreciate the desire to make the dungeon more engaging, but I think this is short sighted.

It erodes trust in DMs and the system if players don't understand why the DM is doing it: some players will interpret this as "the DM is cheating and trying to kill players1!111!'.

It's also not great for Wizards or people who are using ammo as it causes them to burn more of their limited attack resources than are necessary, reducing their effectiveness later in the dungeon.

If DMs are empowered to play this sort of thing by ear, then fine.

If not perhaps this should be a point of emphasis in next years training: "You may think you are doing players a favor, but this can backfire in unexpected ways - do not extend combat even if it seems the combat was too easy."

Did you take in to account the Shambling Mound's immunities/resistances to your parties attackes (e.g. Blunt weapons)?

Ed
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DMs Going off Script? 2 years 1 month ago #3

MasterED wrote:

Matthew Hayward wrote: I'm pretty confident that in the Shambling mound room the DM was extending combat until the horn blew on Saturday.

In 3 trips to the room combat went till the horn blew at which point they announced that the monster was killed - in one case I think we got 5 or maybe even 6 rounds of combat in with a legendary geared party.

Another player on one of my runs mentioned that when they DM they sometimes do the same thing (extend combat till the end if players inflict lethal monster damage early).

I appreciate the desire to make the dungeon more engaging, but I think this is short sighted.

It erodes trust in DMs and the system if players don't understand why the DM is doing it: some players will interpret this as "the DM is cheating and trying to kill players1!111!'.

It's also not great for Wizards or people who are using ammo as it causes them to burn more of their limited attack resources than are necessary, reducing their effectiveness later in the dungeon.

If DMs are empowered to play this sort of thing by ear, then fine.

If not perhaps this should be a point of emphasis in next years training: "You may think you are doing players a favor, but this can backfire in unexpected ways - do not extend combat even if it seems the combat was too easy."

Did you take in to account the Shambling Mound's immunities/resistances to your parties attackes (e.g. Blunt weapons)?

Ed


Well - no because I'm not sure what they are, and the DM wasn't giving any hints.

But I saw 3 combats in that room, and all three went right to the horn, at which point the monster was then killed with the same DM.

The weapons in the parties were not blunt, lots of +3/5 Viper Strike Fangs, Welfor's +5, Avernon's +5...

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DMs Going off Script? 2 years 1 month ago #4

It was also an elemental so it was immune to crits and sneak attacks and if you were playing on nightmare (which I can only assume you were since you were using legendaries) it had a really high AC and a ton of HP

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DMs Going off Script? 2 years 1 month ago #5

The only time I experienced that was on the 7 token run. Otherwise we finished before the horn.
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DMs Going off Script? 2 years 1 month ago #6

Harlax wrote: The only time I experienced that was on the 7 token run. Otherwise we finished before the horn.


What time were your runs? The period in question was between 11-3 on Saturday.

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DMs Going off Script? 2 years 1 month ago #7

Stoner wrote: It was also an elemental so it was immune to crits and sneak attacks and if you were playing on nightmare (which I can only assume you were since you were using legendaries) it had a really high AC and a ton of HP


Certainly could be - the same party though that struggled to take this thing down in 5 or 6 rounds beat death in 3 rounds with damage.

So... there's that.

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DMs Going off Script? 2 years 1 month ago #8

Did you incoperate that in room 7 death only had spell resistnace which majority of players had a eldrich set to by pass it, and that a cure serious wounds delt upwards to 70 dmg?
Aye, that's the rub

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DMs Going off Script? 2 years 1 month ago #9

I'm pretty sure all the DMs were the same for the whole weekend.
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DMs Going off Script? 2 years 1 month ago #10

Matthew Hayward wrote:

Harlax wrote: The only time I experienced that was on the 7 token run. Otherwise we finished before the horn.


What time were your runs? The period in question was between 11-3 on Saturday.


The 7 token group was on Friday.
D&D teaches all the important lessons in life - the low blow, the cheap shot, the back stab, the double cross. - Jerry Marsischky

Let them trap us. We have our swords. - Elric of Melnibone.

You try to get them to play the game, but all they want to do is play the rules. - Ardak Kumerian

I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend - Faramir

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DMs Going off Script? 2 years 1 month ago #11

The DMs were the same for the weekend - I think this was a great thing for consistency. I think overall the DMs and NPCs did a great job.

There will be a riddle reveal with more info, but the shambling mound was immune to critical hits, blunt weapons, shock, mind-affecting magic, and sneak attacks.
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DMs Going off Script? 2 years 1 month ago #12

bpsymington wrote: The DMs were the same for the weekend - I think this was a great thing for consistency. I think overall the DMs and NPCs did a great job.

There will be a riddle reveal with more info, but the shambling mound was immune to critical hits, blunt weapons, shock, mind-affecting magic, and sneak attacks.


I wonder if the DM was ruling all melee damage to be 0 from anyone who had the shock icon on their melee party card (from Bracers of Lightning)?

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