Welcome, Guest
Username: Password: Remember me

TOPIC: General Feedback on Runs

General Feedback on Runs 2 years 1 month ago #13

Please be sure to contact the Adventure Coordinator (AC) for the side you were running to provide feedback. This is usually done either while the issue is happening, in the next room with the next DM, in epilogue, or back at the front by checking with a coach (I often saw the ACs up front). You don't have to directly confront the DM right then and there, but letting the AC know about a situation gives TD the chance to resolve it before it affects many people.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

General Feedback on Runs 2 years 4 weeks ago #14

Furriarty wrote: I too feel like there needs to be a specific run feedback thread or more honestly a complaint form to have action taken against a DM.

This is in reference to: THURSDAY MOONGATE (Combat Oriented) 2:36

I will try to keep this brief but in short one of the DM's in a room was incredibly rude to one of the new players, of which there were a few, for making the mistake of placing a wand in the wizard's weapon puck. A problem which arose from the fact that our information guy at the beginning as well as our combat trainer both seemed very disinterested in teaching us anything about playing.

Then this DM basically called one of our group members "stupid" and continued to belittle her for some time. We understand we are playing a game with rules, but if the rules are not explained don't call us dumb for not knowing them, we paid over 100$ to be there. This experience was so upsetting we almost left without completing the dungeon and very nearly did not go back for our other run the next day. We were willing to eat a 100$ loss rather than go back and deal with the incredibly rude people running the event again.

We were assured by our veteran friends that they always had a great time and we went back the next day and did really enjoy ourselves, but we were extremely soured on the experience from the first guy (I wish I had thought to demand his name).

If this game is going to continue to grow someone needs to be making an effort to be nicer to and more inclusive of newer players as well as doing a better job of screening DMs because this one guy very nearly cost true dungeon what could have been two happy repeat customers.


I am really sorry to hear that! The wizards are pretty complex - some spells require a slide, some do not, some scrolls require a slide, some do not, wands don't require a slide, but there is no way in particular to know that.

Certainly "Wanda don't require a slide" is not part of normal training.

If the wizard player is one of your friends, send me a pm and I'll send them some good wizard stuff for a new player - we need all the wizards we can get :)

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

General Feedback on Runs 2 years 4 weeks ago #15

Wade Schwendemann wrote:

Stoner wrote:

Snuble wrote: On the dancing side the "unlock the chest" puzzle was great, as was the "put everything back in its place". The path of travel puzzle our group didn't have a chance of solving that one. When the DM running the room saw we were having issues, she asked how many had played before, and really tried to help. She wasn't blatantly saying this goes here, but more of the how many obtuse/acute angles, etc.

She did tell us afterwards we were getting closer to figuring out the starting city, but after the start in that room we were not going to get it. I think a group that knew each other would have a better chance of finishing it.

We did have a couple of awesome DM's. My favorite was in dragon room that had a lot of flare and story telling of the combat. The two dm's in the last room did a great job on our run as well.

I will have to ask my friend that was one of our wizards his thoughts. He got a necklace every room you could get one in and that knocked his spells out of combat for awhile.


I DM'd Room 4 Combat side and I just gave them to the first 5 in the room, I play a wizard most of the time and I can imagine getting one was not the ideal situation for them. I tried very hard to get through the NPC interaction and explanation of the necklaces as quickly as possible to give the groups the most time to fight the scrael

I had 2 very different experience's in this room. The first time the group before us seemed to take 3 of our minutes to leave the room, leaving us only 2 rounds of combat. Not ideal.
The second time was much, much better
You did an excellent job both times.


You did a great job with my group, especially so considering someone from the previous group walked out with the Fighter puck. You got that squared away very quickly. Thanks for volunteering.
D&D teaches all the important lessons in life - the low blow, the cheap shot, the back stab, the double cross. - Jerry Marsischky

Let them trap us. We have our swords. - Elric of Melnibone.

You try to get them to play the game, but all they want to do is play the rules. - Ardak Kumerian

I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend - Faramir

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Last edit: by Harlax.

General Feedback on Runs 2 years 4 weeks ago #16

Andrew Ott wrote: When it comes to time yes the 1st initial coach you meet when they fill out the party card it might seemed rushed when they have to look and confirm everyones tokens and put it on the party card, it might not seem that hard but it does take alot of time to fill it out mainly if party members have all the token slots filled, or in books or folders and dobt want to take them out which is rude against the coach and exspect them to look through 10 to 15 pages of tokens, they dont have alot of time to look at every token and put it in the party card, so yes the first coach might seemed rushed, also i heard when i was doing the training coach that i had given more information about playing then all the other training coaches they had encountered
But i just want to say im sorry that people did have rude volunteer encounters and it shouldbt have happend


As a coach, I try very hard to ask any question asked, but sometimes the press of time requires me to say "that will be explained in the training room."

I don't think I've ever been rude, but sometimes I've had to be firm. Like when someone wants to totally rearrange their build with two minutes left in the room. Or when people start trying to rearrange multiple builds after 7 or 8 characters on the party card. I try to accomdate changes, but time can be a factor. And taking a messy party card with you can slow you down as the DM tries to interpret the card.
D&D teaches all the important lessons in life - the low blow, the cheap shot, the back stab, the double cross. - Jerry Marsischky

Let them trap us. We have our swords. - Elric of Melnibone.

You try to get them to play the game, but all they want to do is play the rules. - Ardak Kumerian

I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend - Faramir

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

General Feedback on Runs 2 years 4 weeks ago #17

Exactly, and sometimes you have to say itll be explained in the next room when your crunching for time
i think I'm some sort of wizard

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

General Feedback on Runs 2 years 4 weeks ago #18

I really don't want to start a new thread, so I guess I'll add some thoughts here and blog others.

We did Dancing Combat 8:26AM Thursday, Moongate Combat 11:00PM Thursday, Dancing Puzzle 11:03PM Friday, Moongate Puzzle 10:01PM Saturday, Grind noon Thursday.

All five times we played normal. Other than Grind, every group had new players. We could have played hardcore with two of the groups and done just fine, in all likelihood, but ... [long comments I'll save for my blog].

Dancing Combat
Sorry that we broke four of the rings as the first group Thursday morning, but I'm not surprised when gamers have an opportunity to yank on something. Saw how the puzzle was made easier by the second time we did the second Dancing run.

That first run was ... it was fun, but it was ... frustrating, I guess. The combats were painful, not in terms of hit point damage but in terms of nothing ever being accomplished. Nine Scrael over three fights? Our group took out one. We believe the first fight didn't use the ranger's ranged numbers or something because his to hit bonus on normal was like +16 and he never(?) hit.

Side note: Try to keep this brief. We play a lot of Heroes of Rokugan, the L5R living campaign. All the rage these days is throat punching spellcasters so that they can't cast spells. Don't throatpunch. I'm cool with not being able to Lightning Storm Mad Evoker's Charm on normal with my 70+ hit points because that's OP, but I've been that wizard who got silenced just trying to get off an 11 point Magic Missile, and we played with spellcasters in this run who had nothing to do. If combat is supposed to matter (even on puzzle runs), let people participate. In L5R, the penalty should be increased difficulty on casting. In TD, I guess reduce damage where silenced is just dropped on normal and some other condition effect is used.

Moongate Combat
I love that first room. Besides looking great, I get tired of how dark it is all the time in TD. More rooms with light would be appreciated and would have more contrast. I vastly preferred this dungeon even after playing "both" twice.

For all of the puzzles my groups struggle immensely at, it's interesting when you run across one that you think is incredibly easy. Also, this group was really good. Some players had good levels of experience, newer players didn't struggle with things.

Dancing Puzzle
Vastly easier versions of the first two puzzles. Our group got the workshop just in time. I liked the look of room 7, but it's so not my sort of puzzle. We won the first fight, though our group was way OP for it.

Moongate Puzzle
I liked the flowers room, though we took forever and ran out of time. We ran with someone who knew the dungeon, so it was that problem of how much help to give and when to give it. The three of us (one was sick the whole con and just couldn't do another late night game) decided ahead of time we would do 5th level greedy sealed, which didn't really turn out any easier logistically but was amusing for the player in our group who had never done TD before this con.

Grind
A really great contrast to the dungeons. A really organized group who fights well such that I didn't have to run out of spells and could unleash carnage after the paladin and I got, um, back. We could have done hardcore, but a lot of us weren't familiar with Grind to make that call. I spent a lot of time chatting with Eric because we know each other from way back for another game and we didn't realize the other did TD stuff. The only complaint is that there should have been way more Fae stuff so that there's a reason to use more of the current tokens. I found this to be the best experience, but my ability to chat with an old friend I hadn't seen in years is not something everyone can expect as part of the experience.

Because our collections have grown vastly in the last year, it was a huge learning experience for us. I felt like I had far too many things to worry about as we were often the most "advanced" players. Are we doing normal? Do we have the 5th level cards? Are we fixed on classes? Alt build need something? We should be far more organized next time. Cranston's app was exceedingly useful to us as we made constant adjustments on the fly based on my completing some seven transactions.

I enjoyed myself. I got to do what I like to do which is mostly observe the dungeons and the other players doing what they like to do. I really hope the people we ran with, including the ones that we didn't end up engaging much with enjoyed themselves. But, our group has to be far more organized so that we aren't lugging around wooden padlocked boxes of tokens we can't open on a sealed pack run and whatnot. The logistics internal to us were really annoying, plus Lucas Oil is sufficiently remote that it was a drag going back and forth.

Of more relevance to others, I would work harder to make combat less frustrating for new players on normal. TD is really hard for people at first, I think more so for combat where abilities actually matter, which is why we always focused on puzzle runs in the past. Lockdown effects, enemies that you don't feel you ever make progress against, etc. only make sense for players who know what they are doing.

The puzzles are what the puzzles are. We watched the solution to one of last year's puzzles and still have no idea how you are supposed to solve it, yet another of last year's puzzles was so straightforward I didn't understand why anyone would ever be challenged by it. I think there's an overreliance on wordplay, where I vaguely feel like puzzles from 10 years ago seemed more novel, but that could just be that it's hard to constantly come up with ideas not used before.

Yet, for all that things worked well for me, I'm constantly worried about the mixed bag, the hit or miss, etc. of the TD experience where groups and how groups feel about challenges vary so much.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

General Feedback on Runs 2 years 4 weeks ago #19

Ian Lee wrote: Grind
A really great contrast to the dungeons. A really organized group who fights well such that I didn't have to run out of spells and could unleash carnage after the paladin and I got, um, back. We could have done hardcore, but a lot of us weren't familiar with Grind to make that call. I spent a lot of time chatting with Eric because we know each other from way back for another game and we didn't realize the other did TD stuff. The only complaint is that there should have been way more Fae stuff so that there's a reason to use more of the current tokens. I found this to be the best experience, but my ability to chat with an old friend I hadn't seen in years is not something everyone can expect as part of the experience.


Originally, I had intended to integrate more of the Grind around this year's theme (Rothfuss' world). However, if I went that route, that would require Patrick Rothfuss to go over everything and approve it all. I figure that probably wasn't worth the extra effort. (Plus, I hear there really aren't that many "monsters" in his books).

Next, I thought I could maybe incorporate D&D fey into the Grind but Jeff asked me not to, out of concerns of too much overlap or confusion with Rothfuss' fae.

So the lack of fey/fae was deliberate but the decision was made "above my pay grade" (I am referring to the idiom, since we are volunteers and don't get paid!).

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

General Feedback on Runs 2 years 4 weeks ago #20

I'm adding my thoughts on the main Dungeon here. I've already made a separate thread for my thoughts about Grind.

Check-in:
I feel check-in ran more smoothly and/or was just better laid out than last year. Other than the physical layout change, I'm not sure if things changed behind the scenes, but it definitely felt like an improvement to me.

Storyscape:
I enjoyed past years opportunities to find some clues before you even reached coaching, so a little sad to miss that. But if the trade-off is larger rooms and alleyways, I'm happy to have a smaller storyscape.

Coaching:
My groups were almost entirely coordinate d ahead of time, and even those that weren't made heavy individual use of the spreadsheet or apps. That said, the coaches did a great job handling the few people in my groups that needed it.

Training:
My groups were mostly experienced, but I did have a few newer people on a couple runs. The coaches I ran into did a great job taking care of new people when we had them, and got through the treasure enhancers checks quickly.

NPCs:
Maybe I was just lucky, but for the first time in my experience, all the NPCs felt very engaged and knew their lines well. I particularly liked the Basts. While they all portrayed the same role, all did it in their own way. The two Felurians i saw likewise did good jobs putting their own twists on the role (which is impressive for a no speaking role). The aids to Felurians, the Auris (?), The clerics of Tehlu, the blacksmiths, and the speaker to stones: all we're consistently good as well.

Puzzles:
Really enjoyed the basement lab puzzle, though it was easy to get too caught up in trying to read the documents. The need to "play" with the props really made that puzzle more interesting than average. The furnace puzzle was at the opposite end of the spectrum of enjoyment.

Combats:
Overall I enjoyed the combats, but this is where my biggest complaint for the year comes up. Why were the scrael able to latch on and hinder people that have tokens making them immune to hindrances??? Having tokens that seem explicitly designed to address something like this only to find out they dont apply makes me wonder what the point of those tokens is. :angry:

Rooms:
Room 1 of Moongate was memorable for so many reasons... But I'll be honest, the takeaway I have from that room is that I wish the whole dungeon had AstroTurf or similar flooring. The variety added by the bramble walls was a nice touch, but I really liked Dancing rooms more. The alleyways, the use of ceilings, and other aspects all gave much more sense of actually progressing as we moved forward than I've had other years.

Books tie-in:
I thought that the tie to the books was done pretty well, with touches here and there, and a few subtle spoilers potentially thrown in. It really did feel like we were just passing through their world, while we stuck to the mission we were on, rather than getting too sidetracked by events in that world.

Epilogue:
The fact that there is almost nothing to say about the epilogue room speaks to how smoothly it was running. I never once saw a group waiting on the previous group to wrap up. Sad that completion tokens were running out Saturday night, though that has nothing to do with the group working the epilogue.

Overall:
I think my usual group was in agreement that this year was the best experience we've had in our ten+ years of playing TD. Great job gang.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

General Feedback on Runs 2 years 4 weeks ago #21

Fiddy wrote: Check-in:
I feel check-in ran more smoothly and/or was just better laid out than last year. Other than the physical layout change, I'm not sure if things changed behind the scenes, but it definitely felt like an improvement to me.


Agreed. Haven't seen many comments on that. It was much more spread out and perhaps better staffed too. Huge improvement.
Classes Played: Barbarian (21 times), Monk (11), Cleric (9), Fighter (9), Rogue (9), Dwarf Fighter (7), Ranger (6), Paladin (5), Druid (5), Elf Wizard (2), Wizard (2).

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

General Feedback on Runs 2 years 4 weeks ago #22

Many of the epilogue volunteers were new volunteers or at least new to epilogue. They did a great job - thanks to Kim for helping train them!
Follow me on Instagram @runningboardgamer

Awesome avatar by Mauve Shirt!

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

General Feedback on Runs 2 years 4 weeks ago #23

bpsymington wrote: Many of the epilogue volunteers were new volunteers or at least new to epilogue. They did a great job - thanks to Kim for helping train them!


Yes, the volunteers in the epilogue room went above and beyond.. I owe John a debt I cannot repay. The treasure pulls in general were not a good subject for me. I am not complaining about the pulls, but how it was handled Saturday night.

I had 5 runs Saturday. One of each with 4 great people: Matt, Mat, Jan, and Kevin (Lodestone). Each run was filled-out with 5 other great people (Jedi +1; Mongo +2; Aothos, Rizzen, & Miranda; Edwin, Joe, Al, Kerwin, NHaler, and some fellow Buckeye friends. We survived 3 out of the 4 runs on Nightmare. After that I was immediately in the Cabal run with 4 of the best (Fiddy, Steven, Aaron, & Marlon). The 5 of us survived the run my previous group failed at -- again on Nightmare (Note to TD: running out of rare completion tokens is not acceptable).

So there I was with 61 treasure tokens in my hand (they gave 2 treasure tokens instead of the rare completion token they were out of). I chose to pull 11 and hope they still had 'bags of 50' up front. I was waiting behind one of the others pulling 42. John (the best) suggested I pull at the next table, since nobody was pulling there. I went over and pulled my 11. While this happened we were swarmed by the next groups coming out. I headed up front and was pleased to see they still had bags of 50. I reached into my pocket, but the bag of treasure tokens wasn't there. I searched frantically, and realized I left them in a bag on John's table in the epilogue room before moving to the next table to pull and getting swarmed. So I rushed back, and of course John had seen what I had done and had put my bag of treasure and completion tokens aside. I thanked John and rushed up front just in time to see them disassemble the box to pull bags of 50 from. I went to the pull line just in time to be told that box was shutting down and we should head back to the epilogue room to pull. I rushed back there to find another in my situation pulling at the only non-swarmed table. I waited then I was told i could only pull 20. I pulled my 20, then let the next swarm pull. I moved from line to line tying to find any with a lull between swarms. It was very late before I got all of my pulls.It had to be around Midnight. I really hadn't eaten more than an energy bar that day, so it was good Scotty's served food until 2 AM or Matt H and I would have not been happy.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

General Feedback on Runs 2 years 4 weeks ago #24

Dungeon sets were great and had a great time in the 3 dungeons and 1 grind I ran.

I will agree that treasure could have been handled better Saturday. My group did both of our runs back to back Saturday night so after the first run it was around 10pm and we had about 30 treasure so I tried to get some of the 10 bags in our break between but they were out with only 50 bags remaining. We knew we'd have more than 50 at the end so we held on to the treasure tokens. Once our 2nd run was done after midnight we got our treasure and asked about getting the 50 bags at the store only to be told the store was going to be closed for the rest of the convention and we'd have to draw them at the treasure boxes in epilogue(one volunteer told us it would be open Sunday but we decided not to risk it). It wasn't busy thankfully and were able to draw them quick enough but it seems like there needs to be some better way to handle large treasure pulls at the end of the convention either Saturday night or have the store open Sunday.

Please Log in or Create an account to join the conversation.

Time to create page: 0.249 seconds