TOPIC: Thoughts on Changes to the New Player Experience

I like a lot about this, I'm a big fan of a process that makes getting into the game easier, and lowers barriers. I do have one thing I feel could be improved on, and one concern I'd like to talk about.

I don't feel the idea of sitting down in front of a tablet is better than placing tokens on a player mat. One of the strengths of TD is the physical experience, and this includes the tactile experience of handling tokens, seeing the layout, putting tokens onto slots, and the wonder of hinting at there being so much more than what their ten tokens can cover. I do question a little bit the comparison to CCG sealed, as the complexity of drafting decks usually means making choices of what to cut which is where new players struggle. TD in sealed would rarely have this, as the obvious answer is to use everything, which is fun for new players to play with all their cool toys.

The area I wonder about is the connection with established players, or lack thereof. I feel that one of the best advantages of TD is the community element. Established players have little incentive to do a run with that amount of repetition of known information, and I feel that this is a significant loss to not have new players have some connection with those who have done it before. I had a run last Gen Con, and I was the only player who had any experience. I felt a responsibility to help others have a good time, and overall, I do believe the group enjoyed it, though I don't know how much was based on what I did. It has made me consider a bit about being an ambassador to new players, which I'm still mulling over.

Since this discussion migrated to this thread, I thought I'd just repost what I posted in the other thread.

For a complete rethinking - maybe do away with the sealed random pack aspect, and give each character class a preset set of 10 tokens. If you limit it to 10 classes (maybe get rid of Dwarf Fighter and Elven Wizard) you could have a premade party card that is identical for each run. The tokens could be tailored for the adventure, so every one of them would have a chance to come into play, including the consumables. Or you could make them more generic if you want to purchase / prepare the premade packs to cover several years.

That might significantly (or completely) reduce the coaching room requirements and make it much more new player friendly.

I think there’s much to be said for the idea of a pre-printed party card with all 12 classes listed, and the coach’s main job in a new-player focused sealed pack run being to help people pick a class, make sure they have an appropriate weapon, and then cross out the classes that were not chosen.

But, what we’d lose is the excitement of opening your pack, seeing what you got, and trading with the other party members. (Of course, for some first time players, this can be overwhelming and not make a lot of sense without context.)

When I would coach new players, the sorting token process usually seemed overwhelming to them. I would add up their stats and since most common tokens are conditional, I would usually tell them to hold their weapon, and maybe a potion and then put everything else away and don't worry about them. All the stats are on the party card. Then I would tell them to enjoy the ride, the puzzles, the combats and the experience. I would give them a basic idea how the rooms worked. It seemed to put them at ease and fire them up for the game.
I like the pregenerated party card idea and starter pack for each class. Rangers get two weapons, spellcasters one weapon and a scroll. Barbarian a 2 hand weapon and a potion. Monk maybe two thrown weapons. Then new players can enjoy the ride and the game without the stress of set-up.

Mike Steele wrote: Since this discussion migrated to this thread, I thought I'd just repost what I posted in the other thread.

For a complete rethinking - maybe do away with the sealed random pack aspect, and give each character class a preset set of 10 tokens. If you limit it to 10 classes (maybe get rid of Dwarf Fighter and Elven Wizard) you could have a premade party card that is identical for each run. The tokens could be tailored for the adventure, so every one of them would have a chance to come into play, including the consumables. Or you could make them more generic if you want to purchase / prepare the premade packs to cover several years.

That might significantly (or completely) reduce the coaching room requirements and make it much more new player friendly.

+1

When I started playing in 2012, there was an event called True Dungeon 101. I don't think it was even an official True Dungeon event. I think it was just volunteers who were passionate about the game and wanted to help out new players. It was very helpful. They talked though the character classes and gave us an idea of what the combats and puzzles were like and how they worked.

If True Dungeon did an event like that they could talk through everything you need to know to start playing, have a practice board to slide on, maybe an old puzzle to try to solve and even a treasure box (maybe with a very basic mix) where each attendee could get one treasure draw before they leave.

It would be one potential way to take some of the learning to play out of the chaos of the coaching and training rooms. It could also function as an even smaller taste or introduction to True Dungeon than the 4-room runs to get people interested in playing a short or full True Dungeon run.

There used to be a tutorial on the back of each character card that described how to play your character and highlighted special abilities that might be useful. They removed the tutorial and made the character cards double sided with 4th and 5th level character stats. But maybe for 4-room runs (where I think you can only play as a 4th level character) they could print character cards with the tutorial on the back again. I found the tutorial very helpful when I was a new player.

Michelle wrote: There used to be a tutorial on the back of each character card that described how to play your character and highlighted special abilities that might be useful. They removed the tutorial and made the character cards double sided with 4th and 5th level character stats. But maybe for 4-room runs (where I think you can only play as a 4th level character) they could print character cards with the tutorial on the back again. I found the tutorial very helpful when I was a new player.

Well next year there will be a chance of getting to level 5 out of the pack with one of the mask.

Mike Steele wrote: Since this discussion migrated to this thread, I thought I'd just repost what I posted in the other thread.

For a complete rethinking - maybe do away with the sealed random pack aspect, and give each character class a preset set of 10 tokens. If you limit it to 10 classes (maybe get rid of Dwarf Fighter and Elven Wizard) you could have a premade party card that is identical for each run. The tokens could be tailored for the adventure, so every one of them would have a chance to come into play, including the consumables. Or you could make them more generic if you want to purchase / prepare the premade packs to cover several years.

That might significantly (or completely) reduce the coaching room requirements and make it much more new player friendly.

I like this.

I also like the idea that they could be redeemed/transmuted into something useful (not exclusive or especially valuable, just useful) to help train them to redeem things and learn about that as well.

I love sealed play in most games, but I would never think that I would enjoy sealed if I'm completely new to that game.

Also, it makes the experience tied to luck.. The game experience for new players, to me, should focus on the game itself, rather than conflating it with the elation/ disappointment of a good/bad random pull. (If they even understand the power level of what they got at that point)

If the luck of the draw is still desired, give them that experience after the game with a bonus Treasure pull or something to that effect.

Sealed/ limited play can be great, but it should be completely separate from the new player experience.

A related idea:

If there is still a desire to have tokens distributed and used for their first game, the new player tokens could mostly/all be single use items that get collected at the end so they could be cleaned and recycled for other new players. Turning them in at the end could get them the random pack, etc.

EDIT:
But seriously, a pre-printed new player mat with tokens just printed on it would be more efficient and cost effective.

Michelle wrote: There used to be a tutorial on the back of each character card that described how to play your character and highlighted special abilities that might be useful. They removed the tutorial and made the character cards double sided with 4th and 5th level character stats. But maybe for 4-room runs (where I think you can only play as a 4th level character) they could print character cards with the tutorial on the back again. I found the tutorial very helpful when I was a new player.

Yes I agree. The tutorial on the back of the character cards was great, especially for newer players.