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TOPIC: Dealing with "wandering" Treasure Enhancers

Dealing with "wandering" Treasure Enhancers 6 years 11 months ago #13

Are some people worried about someone handing off TE's in the epilogue room before the audit?

If so why not have a check point right before epilogue where the audit can happen? It would require ~1 extra volunteer instead of ~4. That check point would have to be controlled in some fashion such that there is only one way traffic so that drop offs could not occur.
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Dealing with "wandering" Treasure Enhancers 6 years 11 months ago #14

ANY multiple check system with non-unique identifiers can be exploited.

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Dealing with "wandering" Treasure Enhancers 6 years 11 months ago #15

Joshua Long wrote: Are some people worried about someone handing off TE's in the epilogue room before the audit?

If so why not have a check point right before epilogue where the audit can happen? It would require ~1 extra volunteer instead of ~4. That check point would have to be controlled in some fashion such that there is only one way traffic so that drop offs could not occur.


As there are 2 epilogue rooms this would still require at least 2. Though if it is right before the epilogue rooms how do you catch one run (puzzle) while waiting for the other (combat) with 1 volunteer? There is no way to know which of the two gets done first. Though I may not be understanding completely.
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Dealing with "wandering" Treasure Enhancers 6 years 11 months ago #16

Cavor wrote: ANY multiple check system with non-unique identifiers can be exploited.


Though true having tokens locked in a bag or checked in mid dungeon makes exploits more difficult. Also even with unique identifiers systems can be exploited, just more with more difficulty.
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Last edit: by jedibcg.

Dealing with "wandering" Treasure Enhancers 6 years 11 months ago #17

jedibcg wrote:

Joshua Long wrote: Are some people worried about someone handing off TE's in the epilogue room before the audit?

If so why not have a check point right before epilogue where the audit can happen? It would require ~1 extra volunteer instead of ~4. That check point would have to be controlled in some fashion such that there is only one way traffic so that drop offs could not occur.


As there are 2 epilogue rooms this would still require at least 2. Though if it is right before the epilogue rooms how do you catch one run (puzzle) while waiting for the other (combat) with 1 volunteer? There is no way to know which of the two gets done first. Though I may not be understanding completely.


Ah yes, I forgot there are two epilogue rooms. You are correct that would take at least 2 volunteers.

Yes there could be line from now and then if the puzzle and combat get released at the same time. Though hopefully it would be a fast thing to process. It is a slight trade off versus requiring twice the number of volunteers to do the audit mid dungeon.
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Dealing with "wandering" Treasure Enhancers 6 years 11 months ago #18

We could also change where we review TE's.

Instead of verifying them in the coaching room, they could be verified only in the epilogue room.

It would still leave a little wiggle room for someone to share their TE's with the group behind them, but it would drastically limit the opportunities to pass off to other groups like in the coaching rooms.

Since we can be in the coaching room for nearly an hour, that's a lot of overlap with all of the other starting times.

If TE's were only checked in the epilogue room, there is only the risk of passing them off to the group behind or ahead.

It wouldn't eliminate it entirely, but it could put a huge dent in it.

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Dealing with "wandering" Treasure Enhancers 6 years 11 months ago #19

Joshua Long wrote: If so why not have a check point right before epilogue where the audit can happen? It would require ~1 extra volunteer instead of ~4. That check point would have to be controlled in some fashion such that there is only one way traffic so that drop offs could not occur.

I concur this seems to be very practical and would avoid "double dipping" of TE assuming the traffic is 1 way (no body can enter from the treasure box area and show TE).

Ed
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Dealing with "wandering" Treasure Enhancers 6 years 11 months ago #20

If they are actually checked in the epi room vs just verified then you will need more lights there and more time. Most of the runs will be easy. But there will be runs where there will be 10 people each with their own 4 TE's that will need to be checked. Not saying it is a bad idea just pointing out what would be needed.
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Dealing with "wandering" Treasure Enhancers 6 years 11 months ago #21

Some years back the volunteer token came with a little plastic case with a lanyard.

That could work for the CoA. If you had to wear it through the dungeon and show it at the end, would that be enough? People could still check the bulk of their tokens.

Is the concern bigger than CoA? I doubt anyone is worked up about the 1 treasure items -lens and now cloak.

Is there concern about the 6th level bonus? The AoTF?

The lanyard idea doesn't really work for people relying on multiple tokens - say an AoTF and RoR.

If there is an in dungeon check, maybe a system to check no more than two people per room. Do it by class so Room 1 to 6 has two classes each to minimize time. It would have to be done at the start to avoid interfering with the end of the room rush.

Or we could replace treasuring enhancing tokens with pins similar to the 8th level pin. These could go right on your badge holder, sash, shirt, etc. There would have to be a trade in system like we currently have for the relic to legendary CoA.
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Last edit: by Harlax.

Dealing with "wandering" Treasure Enhancers 6 years 11 months ago #22

Joshua Baessler wrote: If TE's were only checked in the epilogue room, there is only the risk of passing them off to the group behind or ahead.

I think the big scenario that is trying to be stopped is an unscruplous Rogue person shows 10 TE to the coach for team 1 and then also shows the same 10 TE to a coach for team 2.

When Team 1 reaches the Epilogue room the Rogue person mysteriously appears and shows the 10 TE to the volunteer for Team 1. Then when Team 2 appears they do the same thing.

By putting a TE check after Room 7 but before the Epilogue room and only ticketed players enter via Room 7 then the mysterious Rogue should be restricted from validating the TE. Of course Jeff will need to have an AC on standby for any issues and a plan on resolution.

Ed
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Last edit: by MasterED.

Dealing with "wandering" Treasure Enhancers 6 years 11 months ago #23

Do you need to thoroughly check every person through the dungeon? Or could a properly-randomized check suffice? As a possible example: at the top of each hour, the volunteer coordinator (or someone else in a trusted position) checks the randomizer to see which run (or runs) needs to be checked during that hour. She then lets the epilogue room know to check that run when they get out. Those on the runs don't know whether or not they will be audited until they get to the end, so will in theory need to have their TEs with them just in case.

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Dealing with "wandering" Treasure Enhancers 6 years 11 months ago #24

I think that the check has to be done within the Dungeon at the start of some room, rather than in the epilogue room or the coaching training rooms, because it is very possible in the Epilogue, coaching, or training rooms for the system to be gamed. Once in the Dungeon, there's no possibility of handing them off prior to or after the verification check, they will have to be with the group the whole Dungeon.

If it's done at the start, in the coaching or training rooms, someone could exit the room to hand the Treasure Enhancing Tokens to another group after they are verified. If it's done in the Epilogue room, someone could show up with the Treasure Enhancing Tokens and hand them to the group prior to the check (I think last year at GENCON there were reports of people doing exactly that). Plus, there is so much going on in the Epilogue room that it could be overlooked or mishandled.

It could be done by the GM or an NPC in a way that flows with the adventure instead of pulls people out of it. If people are aware that the check is going to be done, they could have the tokens ready and it could take a very short amount of time.

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