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TOPIC: Raising Funds to Preserve JimC’s Legacy

Raising Funds to Preserve JimC’s Legacy 9 years 8 months ago #1

Dear fellow True Dungeon community members,

Many of you are aware that Jim Carter (JimC) recently passed away a few months ago. Jim was a longstanding member of this community and one of the biggest supporters of True Dungeon out there. Many of you may remember reading his posts on this forum or interacting with him at GenCon. Each time you transmute an item or convert for a trade token, you are using formulas that he spent countless hours working on. And every year he would purchase and outfit complete runs for his friends in Nascrag and it became a tradition that they treasured. Few people were as token obsessed as Jim and he loved True Dungeon and the community.

Jim’s twin passions were Nascrag and True Dungeon and while he was alive, he worked tirelessly to contribute to both communities and I know that he would have wanted to continue contributing to the Nascrag and True Dungeon communities. Unfortunately, it has recently come to my attention that some individuals, including well-known members of this forum and community, have been trying to profit off of Jim's death, making offers to try to buy his tokens, and blocking what Jim would have wanted. I know that some of you probably had no idea of the backstory behind this and had no negative intentions when it started. I do not want to go into the personal details here but I wanted everyone to at least know the basics of the situation.

I am writing today to ask that as a community we try to respect what Jim would have wanted. I know that some people only care about the bottom line and tokens are just something to hoard and/or resell to make a quick buck. That might be true for many people out there but I would have hoped that those of us here are different and that True Dungeon and our fellow players and forumites mean more than that, even if you did not know Jim personally. That at the very least we would not try to heartlessly profit from a tragedy like vultures or scavengers.

I have been trying to convince Jim's family to follow through on his wishes and allow his tokens to be held in trust. I hope to be able to set up a True Dungeon memorial run each year in his name for his friends in Nascrag and also to benefit the TD community as a whole whether it be offering token support for TD101 and the Rogues’ Game, or other means of encouraging new people to the event. I am asking that anyone who has been trying to buy Jim's tokens for their own gain to please stop and think about what they are doing. There is nothing I can do to force you and I can only appeal to the better angels of your nature.

When I first heard about this situation, it really upset me greatly. I did not want to think that there were people in this community who would try to capitalize on a tragedy and now that everyone knows what is at stake I hope people will do what is right. I want to believe that this community actually means something and it is more than just cut-throat dollars and cents. And honestly? If I am wrong then I am not sure it is a community I could continue to be a member of.


UPDATE: Based on forumite feedback, it seems like the best option is to try and raise funds so that the friends of JimC can make a bid for the tokens (letting us preserve JimC's legacy if we win). Ideally, the family will then get money while JimC's wishes are still respected. And even if we aren't able to come up with the highest bid, at least we can help reduce the amount that greedy opportunists are able to profit from Jim's death while still ensuring that Jim's family gets more money.

If you are interested in contributing to such an effort to help raise funds for JimC's legacy in a way that respects Jim's wishes and preserves his legacy, please contact me ASAP. Thank you.
Last edit: by Incognito.
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Re: Preserving JimC’s Legacy 9 years 8 months ago #2

I met jim and talked/traded with Jim a few times(and I bought tokens from him as well)
If these people are buying the tokens and his family is getting the money, I see nothing wrong with that
I was not remotely close to jim, but if it was my tokens, I would want my family to have money for them and not just give them away
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Re: Preserving JimC’s Legacy 9 years 8 months ago #3

  • henwy
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Holy shit. Frankly, I can't believe this is how things ended up. I knew a little about this and how Jim had asked for his tokens to go to his best friend so that the Nascrag group could continue the yearly tradition but I had no idea it ended up like this. I find it hard to imagine that anyone who's a member of this community would do something this shitty. I know for a fact that Jim's family was and is really well off and anyone claiming they're trying ot buy the tokens for the good of the family's financial well-being is full of shit. Maybe these people didn't know that this is what Jim had wanted and had no clue about the backstory. I can only hope that is the case because it'd be hard to imagine someone who'd try to make bank off his death and give his final wishes the finger. In case whoever this twatwaffle @!#% did know, then I think you should out them because I know personally I wouldn't want anything to do with someone like that.

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Last edit: by henwy.
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Re: Preserving JimC’s Legacy 9 years 8 months ago #4

I would have to agree. If the family wants or needs the money that is far more important than this community... in my opinion. I see no harm in people making fair offers. The family can always decline.
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Re: Preserving JimC’s Legacy 9 years 8 months ago #5

If you are unable to complete what you are working on, Incognito, maybe selling them in an auction that benefits the family or charity, or some combination may be the best idea. I would say that anyone trying to turn tragedy into an opportunity to profit should be ashamed, if I thought they could actually feel shame.
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Re: Preserving JimC’s Legacy 9 years 8 months ago #6

The most important thing is the families wishes. If they want to keep them or sell them its up to them.
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Re: Preserving JimC’s Legacy 9 years 8 months ago #7

ian ferguson wrote: If you are unable to complete what you are working on, Incognito, maybe selling them in an auction that benefits the family or charity, or some combination may be the best idea. I would say that anyone trying to turn tragedy into an opportunity to profit should be ashamed, if I thought they could actually feel shame.


I agree with you Ian.

My outrage is that a member of this close community (not just some random outsider) is trying to profit out of Jim's death.

If there is to be profit made by selling or auctioning off Jim's tokens, I agree it should go to Jim's family *not* a ruthless opportunist.
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Re: Preserving JimC’s Legacy 9 years 8 months ago #8

Not to be a devils advocate, but wouldn't the people in Jim's group be profiting off those tokens? This is a reminder for all of us to prepare for the unexpected with wills and plans in writing and notarized.
If Jim's group was willing to pay to have a trust setup to see to the long term disposition of those tokens then they should talk to the family and go for it. I could easily see how those tokens would walk away if that group disbanded or had a schism though. Then his family is left with nothing.
I for one hope that if I passed away, that someone would make my family a fair offer for my tokens (of which my wife understands little) and that my significant stash could further benefit my family.

These situations are always difficult, but unless the deceased placed their wishes in writing in a legal manner, it is up to the next of kin to see to the disposition of property.
Tinker, Gnome, Wizard, DIE!
Last edit: by EN 429.
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Re: Preserving JimC’s Legacy 9 years 8 months ago #9

Chris Von Wahlde wrote: The most important thing is the families wishes. If they want to keep them or sell them its up to them.


I do think the family's wishes are important. Very important.

But as to "most important," I personally think the departed's wishes are the most important.

Speaking for just me, if something unexpected happens to me, I would hope that my friends and family respect what *I* would have wanted, not what my family (or parents) want.
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Re: Preserving JimC’s Legacy 9 years 8 months ago #10

Incognito wrote:

Chris Von Wahlde wrote: The most important thing is the families wishes. If they want to keep them or sell them its up to them.


I do think the family's wishes are important. Very important.

But as to "most important," I personally think the departed's wishes are the most important.

Speaking for just me, if something unexpected happens to me, I would hope that my friends and family respect what *I* would have wanted, not what my family (or parents) want.


I can agree with that. However sadly that doesn't always happen... as was stated above I would think most people would want their families taken care of first. Sadly I didn't know Jim, nor what he would have wanted... I'm just giving my opinion. However in the long run it may be easier and more beneficial for the family to take an offer... again I don't know what they would want to do.
Last edit: by Chris Von Wahlde.
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Re: Preserving JimC’s Legacy 9 years 8 months ago #11

Eric, I really respect your friendship with Jim and your desire to honor his wishes and memory. I didn't really know Jim very well, which was my loss, and I had no idea that he paid for and outfitted his NASCRAG group (or that he was even interested in NASCRAG), that his family was very well off, or that his desire was to have his tokens stay in a trust for the use of his friends.

I haven't made any inquiries into buying Jim's token collection, but I had thought (given my lack of knowledge of any of the above info) that it was likely that at some point they might be sold to benefit his family. It's certainly possible that some people that might have made inquiries did not know any of the backstory or his wishes with respect for his tokens, and genuinely thought that his family might benefit from the sale of some of his tokens. They might not have been trying to profit from his loss or to block his wishes. I do hope that anyone that is aware that Jim wanted all of his tokens to stay intact and be used by his friends would respect his wishes.
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Re: Preserving JimC’s Legacy 9 years 8 months ago #12

Scancon wrote: If these people are buying the tokens and his family is getting the money, I see nothing wrong with that
I was not remotely close to jim, but if it was my tokens, I would want my family to have money for them and not just give them away

Chris Von Wahlde wrote: I would have to agree. If the family wants or needs the money that is far more important than this community... in my opinion. I see no harm in people making fair offers. The family can always decline.

ian ferguson wrote: If you are unable to complete what you are working on, Incognito, maybe selling them in an auction that benefits the family or charity, or some combination may be the best idea. I would say that anyone trying to turn tragedy into an opportunity to profit should be ashamed, if I thought they could actually feel shame.

EN 429 wrote: If Jim's group was willing to pay to have a trust setup to see to the long term disposition of those tokens then they should talk to the family and go for it. I could easily see how those tokens would walk away if that group disbanded or had a schism though. Then his family is left with nothing.

You guys make some excellent points, especially EN 429. I definitely agree that the family (Jim's parents) should be taken care of.

Perhaps I was just a tad bit too idealistic with my original hopes. I guess I ended up presenting a (false) dichotomy where preserving JimC's legacy and his family getting money were two mutually exclusive events.

Based on EN 429 valuable insights, maybe the best option would be to try and raise money so that the Friends of JimC could make a competitive bid (and if they win, then preserve JimC's legacy).

For those who are concerned about JimC's family, this would up the amount that they would receive (regardless of who won).

And even if we cannot match the other bidder(s), at least we can cut into their profit margins so that they are not profiting as much from JimC's death (and that cut would go directly to the family due to the higher price).

So now it wouldn't be an issue of whether or not JimC's family gets money or not. But whether friends of JimC who want to preserve his memory can triumph over those trying to make a killing by graverobbing his corpse.

Unfortunately, we only have a few days.

But if anyone is interested in contributing to an effort to raise funds and preserve JimC's legacy (both of which would benefit his family), please contact me privately.
Last edit: by Incognito.
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