TOPIC: Feedback Needed on Relic/Legend Event Idea

I think 4C is an unofficial term anyway for transmuted tokens, carried over from the pre-transmuted token days.

Mike Steele wrote:

Xavon wrote: Exalted (a.k.a. Rare+) are the four pointed star.
Relics (a.k.a. UR+) have a five point star.

The Draco-lich Claw Charm is also a relic, but instead of a UR+, it is the last (until the Ring of Heroism) of the 4C tokens. I am not sure what that means for the other 4Cs.

I'm curious, why are you referring to the Ring of Heroism as a 4C token? Those are traditionally the ones that take all the monster ingredients from one year plus one or two from the next. The Ring of Heroism relies more on participation tokens than monster tokens (other than a Golden Fleece). I won't be surprised to see a 4C token in next year's set, they are usually every other year.

4C every other year? really? i remember when we had to save TWO years of monster bits and needed a couple bits from the THIRD year to make the big token (i think that was the medallion of greyhawk).

kurtreznor wrote:

Mike Steele wrote:

Xavon wrote: Exalted (a.k.a. Rare+) are the four pointed star.
Relics (a.k.a. UR+) have a five point star.

The Draco-lich Claw Charm is also a relic, but instead of a UR+, it is the last (until the Ring of Heroism) of the 4C tokens. I am not sure what that means for the other 4Cs.

I'm curious, why are you referring to the Ring of Heroism as a 4C token? Those are traditionally the ones that take all the monster ingredients from one year plus one or two from the next. The Ring of Heroism relies more on participation tokens than monster tokens (other than a Golden Fleece). I won't be surprised to see a 4C token in next year's set, they are usually every other year.

4C every other year? really? i remember when we had to save TWO years of monster bits and needed a couple bits from the THIRD year to make the big token (i think that was the medallion of greyhawk).

You're right, I'd forgotten, that first 4C token did require all three monster tokens from 2006, all three from 2007, and one from 2008.

Dennis Burdick wrote: When the high level players aren't running, the special four room mini-adventure can be open to any player for 22 generic tickets? How many curious people get turned away from True Dungeon, because of limited sceduling. On the same note, why isn't True Dungeon open throughout the night-morning on Friday and Saturday? Nine hours at four dungeons at five groups of ten at $44 adds up? Why close?

I think the space might be used for grind during the off hours. That said even if the space isn't being used for something else it would make it a lot special as a buyer reward if you anyone could just show up with generics and wait in queue. Not saying that I wouldn't love a more publicly available retro dungeon just that I don't think this is the place to try to work it in.

I LOVE this idea on the whole.

Now that heavier gear is accumulating, even the NM combat was a bit... easy... this year.

Landspeeder_95 wrote: I LOVE this idea on the whole.

Now that heavier gear is accumulating, even the NM combat was a bit... easy... this year.

It would depending if you have relics. Just because you buy 2k in 2014 tokens doesn't mean you will have any relics for the 2014 run.

EDIT: Sorry misunderstood. Nevermind what I said. I thought you meant for 2014 NM would be easy.

I'm currently working my through the thread but a summary post with the current state of the idea would be nice, and if Jeff could link to it in the opening post that would be great to. Hopefully I will have more relevant thoughts when I get though the 30ish pages.

Just getting caught up on all this tonight. I've been extra busy at work. Seems like I'm always busy after GENCON, maybe because I always slack off for a couple weeks before GENCON? When I left off it was on like page 9, now 26...lots to read.

Anyway I really like the direction this is taking, great ideas out there and hope I can participate in it next year. Nothing new to add just keep up the great ideas! Love the white backed token idea sounds like so much fun.

Coming into this very late, but figured I would give my thoughts. I am coming at this from a player who was definitely not planning on paying 2k on tokens next year. I find this idea tempting, but I don't know if I will actually push my token order up that far. One thing to consider is it may increase the number of PYP slots that people are going to try to sell on the boards next year. I have no idea if that will be good, bad, or even make a difference at all. I just know that is an option I am considering.

I like the current AG idea. I like the idea of the white tokens. Some thoughts on the specifics.

I agree that removing non-basic tokens (completion, combo/transmutation, volunteer) is probably a good idea.
I like the general concept of the class theme sets.

• Barbarian - Sounds like it has been taken care of. The 2 Ogre Power pieces, the two 2H rings, and the boar helm all sound like good options.
• Bard - I really agree that the Lyre of Echoes is a good call here. As has been stated it allows the Bard to participate in combat while still assisting the party with bard song.
• Paladin - The shield seems a better fit for the theme than the helm.
• Weapons - I think the base assumption should be that you aren't going to have someone bringing in their own set of the 40 tokens. This means that the dagger is going to have to be used for the Paladin, the Ranger off-hand, the Bard (assuming they aren't singing constantly), and the Druid. (From my perspective getting the wizards a weapon is less critical.) I agree with the Paladin's theme of defense, but the thought of a Paladin (or even the Bard) attacking with a dagger makes me sad. The other 2 aren't as bad in my eyes but still don't really fit the concept of those types that I have always had. I'm not sure what the answer here is as there is nothing that really fits all 4 situations and adding multiple tokens for this would dilute the general pool with tokens that are far too specific.
• Consumables - I like the idea of "consumables" that are usable 1/room but not collected for 1 big reason, Polymorph. I really like this aspect of the Druid and without some sort of non-collected consumable mechanic it won't be present. With a mechanic of that sort one of the Druid items could be swapped for a polymorph potion.
• Usability - I liked the idea of the white tokens being forbidden outside of the AG/Planar dungeon. As I think Jeff mentioned, this allows new and interesting tokens to be tried without worry about their impact on the general game. This could be something just off the wall for fun, or even try something out that may make it to the general token pool if it works out well. In addition it would allow a non-potion Polymorph token that bypasses the above issue with consumables. Only thing I have seen suggested that makes me think the white tokens need to be usable in the regular dungeons is if a new unique token were added, but in my mind even that would be better as a completion token. Perhaps a unique color token (blue?) that would stand out, but the ruling could still be that white tokens are forbidden. (just brainstorming, no idea if this would be prohibitively expensive or cause other problems).

It seems I had other thoughts but they have melted away while reading this beast of a thread.

Thanks again all for the great input here. Just wanted to update you on the current direction we are heading. There will be a set of 40 Astral tokens (white backed) included with every 2K purchase. The 2K level of support gives you one admission into the special 4 room dungeon and one set of 40 Astral tokens, along with an Adventurer’s Guild Badge.

The exact makeup of the 40 Astral tokens has not been decided, but we are leaning toward using 40 from the current year’s set. Thus every year, the Astral tokens will change but they will match tokens from that year's set.

All Astral tokens (from that year or any previous year) can be used in the 4 room dungeon along with Relic, Legendary, and Eldritch tokens.

More info will be posted as things develop. Thanks again!

I like this approach. Put me down for $2k.

Will the admission method be soul forged? Or tradeable? I don't see 8k buyers not wanting to bring their friends along.