TOPIC: Charm of Treasure Idea

Mike Steele wrote:

Picc wrote: What would people think about Mikes original idea for a 10 pull treasure charm of synergy with the restriction that it cant be worn with other treasure find items (HP&ROR) or if it is it looses the synergy part of the effect and just generates 1 additional pull.

i.e. you have to choose between the synergy effect (13 pulls if everyone has one (assuming 3 are your regular pulls)) or the current HOP + ROR build (12 pulls if everything goes to plan).

I wouldn't be in favor of a new token that in essence replaces and obsoletes the two existing Token Drawing Tokens, any new token-drawing token should be additive to the existing HoP and RoR. I'm also not in favor of having it take two or three Charm slots. In general people don't get excited about tokens with major drawbacks.

But does it really make them obsolete? Yes, if you had all ten people wear them, it would be one more treasure than if you had both Ro¥ and HoP. But if even one person doesn't than it's a wash. If you can only get three to five people to wear them, it's better than a Ro¥, but still not equal to the best HoP outcome.

I still like the idea of a Synergy style power.

What if it was:
2-4 people - one extra treasure coin for each wearer
5-9 people - one extra treasure stamp for the party
10 people - Treasure stamps for the party is set to four

Xavon wrote: I still like the idea of a Synergy style power.

What if it was:
2-4 people - one extra treasure coin for each wearer
5-9 people - one extra treasure stamp for the party
10 people - Treasure stamps for the party is set to four

I like the Synergy Power also. Your example would work, how about also something like this?
1-3 people, one unstamped treasure stamp is stamped
4-6 people, two unstamped treasure stamps are stamped
7-9 people, three unstamped treasure stamps are stamped
10 people, you get four stamped treasure stamps

darkangel866 wrote: Didn't you start this thread? (I know that sounds snarky, sorry) I'm enjoying throwing ideas out there, and I hope others are enjoying reading them. Even if nothing comes from them, it has been fun dreaming up the ideas.

Sorry if I was too strong in my response. I'm not crazy about tokens that are too confusing to calculate or that penalize those with older tokens. But I agree that all ideas are welcome, and thanks for tossing some innovative ideas out there

Going along with the idea that maybe the charm could be used solely for the Treasure Map boxes, how about something like this:

Charm of Map Sense
Be given one Treasure Map fragment for each Charm of Map Sense in party

The upside to this is that it doesn't devalue the Hop or RoR, and it gives the potential for more treasure, but it doesn't have the same extra power as 10 additional treasure draws.

Also, to get around TD having to print up new Treasure map fragments every year, maybe a punch card could be given/used to accumulate treasure fragment stamps.

For example: Run one all 10 members of the group wear one, each member would get 1 full punch card, and 1 punch card with 3 holes punched on it.
Run 2: 4 Members of the previous run have charm of map sense, but running with 3 players that don't have charm. The four members who have it present there partially punched card at end of run to receive the final four stamps needed for the treasure map, and the 3 without charms receive none.

One potential downside to this is that it could be more confusing for the people working the treasure desk, and depending on how much cards cost, but like most people have pointed out, the huge surge of extra orders this could generate might outweight them.

A Treasure Map token doesn't appeal to me. I'm not saying its not a good idea, but I have plenty of trade token bait already. . .

Christopher Nieporte wrote: Going along with the idea that maybe the charm could be used solely for the Treasure Map boxes, how about something like this:

Charm of Map Sense
Be given one Treasure Map fragment for each Charm of Map Sense in party

The upside to this is that it doesn't devalue the Hop or RoR, and it gives the potential for more treasure, but it doesn't have the same extra power as 10 additional treasure draws.

Also, to get around TD having to print up new Treasure map fragments every year, maybe a punch card could be given/used to accumulate treasure fragment stamps.

For example: Run one all 10 members of the group wear one, each member would get 1 full punch card, and 1 punch card with 3 holes punched on it.
Run 2: 4 Members of the previous run have charm of map sense, but running with 3 players that don't have charm. The four members who have it present there partially punched card at end of run to receive the final four stamps needed for the treasure map, and the 3 without charms receive none.

One potential downside to this is that it could be more confusing for the people working the treasure desk, and depending on how much cards cost, but like most people have pointed out, the huge surge of extra orders this could generate might outweight them.

Since the regular treasure coins will be Chip starting this year, Jeff could easily print the Charm of Treasure coins as wooden tokens. One big print run might be all he needs, since they will be recycled as they are turned in. The wooden tokens could represent treasure map fragments (turn in 7 for 10 draws) or they could just represent one draw each (which might be easier for those that don't get a quantity dividable by 7). If they were "Ancient Treasure" treasure coins, theoretically Jeff could introduce other tokens that granted "Ancient Treasure" treasure coins, or even include them as commons in future sets.

Mike Steele wrote:

Xavon wrote: I still like the idea of a Synergy style power.

What if it was:
2-4 people - one extra treasure coin for each wearer
5-9 people - one extra treasure stamp for the party
10 people - Treasure stamps for the party is set to four

I like the Synergy Power also. Your example would work, how about also something like this?
1-3 people, one unstamped treasure stamp is stamped
4-6 people, two unstamped treasure stamps are stamped
7-9 people, three unstamped treasure stamps are stamped
10 people, you get four stamped treasure stamps

I have two reservations about that version.

First, if your party is half-way decent, and gets all the treasure stamps, you get no particular benefit unless everyone is wearing one. I think a UR charm should be more than a stamp insurance policy.

Second is reflected in the way I designed my version; I think this should be a token that requires 'teamwork'. A single player alone shouldn't get anything, and if less than half of the party is equipped, only the equipped individuals reap the benefits. On that note, my suggestion was also specifically designed so that if less than half the party has this charm, it does not stack with HoP, but half or more, it does.

Also, just a gameplay note, your version would seem to work in or out of the dungeon, but would have to be resolved at the desk at the end to avoid cheating (players lying to the DM about getting previous stamps legitimately, and doubling up on the effect).

Or for a version that doesn't stack with HoP:
1-3 people: each person gets one additional Treasure (not stamp)
4-6 people: each person gets two additional Treasures (not stamps)
7-9 people: each person gets three additional Treasures (not stamps)
10 people: each person gets four additional Treasures (not stamps)

I know this contradicts my previous design desire (no solo benefit), but the math works better.

Xavon, your version seems pretty reasonable, it is similar to the simpler version of getting +1 Treasure Coin for each person with a Charm, but has a cap on the total amount.

But, why would you stipulate that it wouldn't stack with HoP? Why wouldn't it work for everyone, regardless of whether you have an HoP and/or RoR?

I LOVE tokens that mess with the treasure boxes, and suggested something similar during 2011 token development:

Misers’ Charm – (Charm) Fills in a single treasure stamp, if one is missed in the dungeon. (I can’t take credit for this, it is simply repackaged into an UR. This was a great idea when it was a Elf Wizard 5th level spell, and I was sorry to see it removed)

My general thought is that Treasure Token URs be on roughly a three-year rotation (ie. 2011-2012 RoR is available. 2013 takes a break. And for 2014-2015 a new item is introduced). This would keep them as desired URs, while making it accessible for newcomers.

The thing that mainly challenges me is how to formulate it, balancing keeping it interesting, fair, and allowing for healthy pull bonus without making it overpowering (especially for those with HoP).
Filling out incomplete stamps is a nice bridge, benefiting the party, without causing excessive pulls.
I toyed with the idea of “Put one pull back in the box & draw another”- but that would give an unfair advantaged to people who ran on Thursday, leaving dregs left for Sunday runners. So that’s a no go.

Clarified, perhaps this:
Charm of Treasure Finding – (Charm) Fill in +1 unfilled treasure stamp (if one is missed in the dungeon) for every party member wearing a Charm of Treasure Finding.

And of course, there is always this:
Hornucopia – (Amulet) Amulet allows 2 draws from treasure box instead of 1.

Love the name "Hornucopia!"

I like your Charm of Treasure Finding. And it isn't overpowered, since there will be adventures where you already get all 3 Treasure Stamps. I'd like it to also raise the number of possible stamps to 4

bpsymington wrote: Love the name "Hornucopia!"

That is one of those words I would only put into Google when I was alone.