TOPIC: ROSP Subclass Distribution

kurtreznor wrote:

SageSTL wrote:

Picc wrote: If they did get adjusted that would make first year cards a cool collectible

I'd be really surprised if they were changed; I assumed that there were a bunch printed for future years, but I could be wrong there.

seeing as there is talk of re-doing the regular character class cards, I would be surprised if we didn't re-do the sub-classes. think of this year as a trial run to see how they played. and what we learned is: some abilities aren't that prized, while treasure finding is overwhelmingly valued.
now, when they are re-made, they can be better balanced.

It also shows that if Jeff ever creates a token with treasure finding ability, that will probably be the best selling token of all time!

The Prestige classes were specifically designed not to be any more powerful than the standard classes. So for that reason most of the classes aren't all that compelling. But the Bard has an effect that results in long-term and monetary benefits so it isn't surprising that it trumps the rest.

Now if other Prestige classes had long-term benefits (like extra XP or something) I'd bet they'd be more popular (not proposing that, just an example).

Likewise, if Prestige classes like Ranger and Wizard were more powerful it might be interesting to see how many people choose extra in-game power versus more treasure.

I did play the Monk prestige class. I didn't play it for the powers just for the novelty of keeping the card.

If everything stayed the same I would give my prestige to our Bard next year.

Ed

A second monk. Used it for Grind. I found the free potion per combat to be highly useful. The initiative bonus was also nice.

Dwarf fighter and Ranger.
The first time the whirlwind-thing hit her and she said "I'm hit, everyone heal!" was the last time it swung at her for some reason.

I'm not trying to discredit the treasure finding bard power but consider this: If the puzzles had been easier there would have been far less call for it. Since there were a few puzzles that generally eluded many folks the power was more useful this year. I doubt last year it would have been so desired.

My rod went unused this year otherwise I would have used it on the GT run.

Brad Mortensen wrote: Dwarf fighter and Ranger.
The first time the whirlwind-thing hit her and she said "I'm hit, everyone heal!" was the last time it swung at her for some reason.

Ugh. Metagaming.

valetutto wrote: I'm not trying to discredit the treasure finding bard power but consider this: If the puzzles had been easier there would have been far less call for it. Since there were a few puzzles that generally eluded many folks the power was more useful this year. I doubt last year it would have been so desired.

My rod went unused this year otherwise I would have used it on the GT run.

I completely agree about bard being better this year due to specific puzzles. If our friends who had already done zephyr didnt warn us that they werent sure we could finish the puzzles in 12 minutes, it definitely wouldnt have been bard.

Xavon wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote: Dwarf fighter and Ranger.
The first time the whirlwind-thing hit her and she said "I'm hit, everyone heal!" was the last time it swung at her for some reason.

Ugh. Metagaming.

I don't know if it's right to chalk that up to "metagaming".

There's 10 targets to attack. Most combats go 3, maybe 4 rounds. The odds of the same target being attacked twice are actually very low. And sometimes, when a DM does attack the same class multiple times, the player gets upset, saying they were being "unfairly targeted" so they deliberately spread the love.

Also, some DMs have scripts saying which character to attack. Some evil creatures always attack the Paladin first. Some intelligent monsters go for the Wizards. Some DMs will hit whoever is standing closest, or whoever did the most damage the previous round.

Assuming it's "Metagaming" that the DM didn't attack the Prestige Dwarf a second time is, in my mind, ascribing to malice what could be simple happenstance.

That said, some monsters really are intelligent enough to pick their targets wisely. I'm not saying that the Whirlwind had any intelligence, but I know that many Grind monsters are smart monsters. Enemy Wizards will often target the low-AC party Wizards, or try to take out the Bard to remove the BardSong. Predator creatures will actively hunt for low-AC targets, and try to separate them from the herd. If players can use tactics, so can the monsters.

Xavon wrote:

Brad Mortensen wrote: Dwarf fighter and Ranger.
The first time the whirlwind-thing hit her and she said "I'm hit, everyone heal!" was the last time it swung at her for some reason.

Ugh. Metagaming.

???

The monster tried to hit a player. After hitting the player there seemed to be a minimal effect (or if anything, the party got stronger). Monster learned from it and decided to avoid attacking that player.

Metagaming would be if the DM saw the Dwarven Defender from the beginning and decided to avoid attacking at all. Though even then, if the character is heavily armored with high AC, it would be a less attractive target anyway.

Raven wrote: There's 10 targets to attack. Most combats go 3, maybe 4 rounds. The odds of the same target being attacked twice are actually very low. And sometimes, when a DM does attack the same class multiple times, the player gets upset, saying they were being "unfairly targeted" so they deliberately spread the love.

Also due to recent power creep (Cloak of Shadowskin, Lenses of Divine Sight), from a strategic standpoint it makes sense for monsters to focus their attacks rather than spread them out.

That said, some monsters really are intelligent enough to pick their targets wisely. I'm not saying that the Whirlwind had any intelligence, but I know that many Grind monsters are smart monsters.

And even the unintelligent monsters may have orders that they are following. Or could be getting telepathic directions from their master as to who they should be attacking.

I used the Sorcerer and while it was fun, i'd have been as happy with the normal class. I think it was a disappointment overall and hope they do change. I'm hoping for slightly better then the normal classes with how few are out there.

I disagree that the sub-classes should be more powerful. They are automatically fifth level already. Isn't the difference of the experience reward enough? Besides, someone who is able to get a sub-class is already likely to be pretty purple/powerful.